New here...finding my way around

[dwerden]

This is just a general while-you-are-looking-for-a-tuba comment. A lot of my recent tuba playing (after leaving the Coast Guard) was in my church brass group. I used my only tuba, which is the Sovereign compensating Eb.

More recently we had a personnel re-shuffle, and most of the time I need to cover higher parts (trombone 1 or euphonium) as well as one or two pieces on tuba parts. The euphonium I use is a large bore with a big sound, but I just don't feel like I'm giving the bass line what it needs. So while you CAN cover the parts on euphonium, it won't sound like a tuba. In some music that's just fine. Lighter works often "like" a lighter bass line.

I remember talking to Sam Pilafian while he was still in the Empire Brass. He was asking about brands of euphonium to buy, because there were often pieces in their programs where he thought the sound of a tuba was too heavy (no gasping, out there!).

So a euphonium can work, and it can be less than satisfying, depending.

Then we get into make/model. A quality non-comp typically blows more freely than some compensating horns. I know that's overly-broad, but in general the compensating system adds more bends and passages. So you may find getting the notes out easier with your non-comp. The trade-off is that a non-comp does not have a good concert Eb or B-natural in the range below F just under the bass clef staff. You need to be good at lipping pitch, or you can work with some creative fingerings/slide-pulls. But you CAN enhance the sound by using a much larger mouthpiece. I do that if I am only playing medium or low stuff, but I don't like the unfocused sound in the upper range.

Your quest for a tuba is a good idea, in my experience. If you can find a BBb or CC that you like and can manage physically, you'll have a more satisfying experience on those bass parts. Even with my Eb I really enjoyed planting the bottom of the chord or producing a nicely-moving bass line to help keep tempo going. (It didn't take me long to figure out why tuba players like their chosen instrument so much!)

I assume you've already poked around this forum on the topics about used horns and about the newer Chinese clones. That would be good background. Another consideration is the case or gig bag you will use. Again, lots of valuable discussion on this board. A former bandsman with me used to choose his new cars based on how his tuba(s) would fit, so unless you're going to stay home with the horn that is a consideration. Some cases offer great protection, but are huge and unwieldy. If you are testing a horn, one thing I would do is put it in its case and carry it, put it up on a table, and try some simulated into-the-trunk (or back seat) maneuvers with it. (At times when my back is acting up, I wish my Sovereign weren't so darned heavy!)

[termite]

Hi Euphomom

I think learning bass clef would be good for both euphonium and BBb tuba. You could try getting a beginner BBb tuba book and working through it. That way you'd be starting off with only a couple of notes and working up from there, much easier than trying to learn every note on the instrument at once.

Try playing both EEb and BBb tubas and see which one feels best to you. Pitching BBb may come easier after Bb euphonium, although I've met many eupho players who double on EEb tuba. I think a compensating British style EEb would be capable of a lot more than a 3 valve or non compensating EEb. You can do a lot on even a 3 valve BBb as you can go pretty low without being all that low on the instrument itself.

I'm not that in love with the sound of the British EEB - they can sound a bit "vanilla" and hard depending on who's playing it. I think something like a Miraphone 186 BBb (orC) or King 2341 may give a more interesting, characteristic tuba sound.

Regards

Gerard

[GC]

Along those lines, I wonder how successful tuba players who try to use tuba-sized mouthpiece cups on euph/baritone or bass trombone are. I find that medium large cups work best for me when doubling, and I prefer medium large cups on tuba. Gigantic cup sizes on any instrument so often give a washed-out tone.

[Donn]

So, that being said...I'm looking for a 4-valve BBb, not really caring about the type or placement of valves... OR a CC if I can find a reasonably priced one.

Atlanta looks like pretty good hunting grounds to me. Note that you may be getting messages through the bulletin board, apart from replies posted to this thread - check the light blue banner line near the top of the page.

[Donn]

Along those lines, I wonder how successful tuba players who try to use tuba-sized mouthpiece cups on euph/baritone or bass trombone are.

Some people seem more locked into a particular rim size than others? I don't know that for a fact, but it just seems like once in a while someone shows up apparently needing to use a fairly inappropriate rim size for that reason.

The desperate solution in this case, accepting the necessity of one rim to rule them all, could be to vary the depth - wide but weirdly shallow mouthpiece for euphonium, for example.

[GC]

I believe Doug Elliot makes a cup for that very application.

[dwerden]

nearly off-topic...being dragged off on to a tangent via other posts:
Also, those trombone/euphonium players who try to find absolutely the smallest mouthpiece possible in order to double on tuba are rarely very successful - to my ears - sonically.

I agree, at least for the long run. When I first started working on tuba I used a Wick 5, which is pretty small. It helped me play the horn, but gave me a shallower sound than I wanted. I stuck with it for a few months, because larger mp's were just too much for me to control. But once I sort-of knew my way around the horn I went to Giardinelli (when they still have a nice shop in NYC) and tried more conventional mp's. I wound up with a Schilke 67. It wasn't too tough to make the change, and it made my sound much more acceptable. I'm still using that and have used it for a couple brass bands (on the Eb parts) and various small ensembles. For me it's a pretty good choice. BTW, I'm not shooting for a huge symphonic sound. I want to make a nice tuba sound for supporting a brass ensemble or for covering the high tuba parts in a brass band.

Anyway, that's the path that worked for me. Folks on the forum here may have suggestions based on a wider pool of experiences than just my one path!