Properly Tuning a CC tuba

[roughrider]

Without incurring the wrath of the TubeNet Jury, would someone please explain to me in very simple terms, 'How do you tune a CC tuba?" I have played BBb for three decades now and the CC is not getting near enough use. Perhaps it would if I could play it in tune. Any helpful suggestions welcome and no, unhelpful suggestions are not welcome! I have been reading this board for way too long. Thanks Very Much

[Jay Bertolet]

If I can infer from your post that you don't have any issues playing your BBb tuba in tune and the issues only exist when you play the CC tuba......well then, you have your answer.

[swillafew]

Either you need to practice it more, or maybe it's a poor horn. One way or the other, practice will reveal the answer. Practicing with a reference pitch (keyboard, recording, etc) helps me a great deal. Mouthpiece buzzing is wonderful exercise too.

[roughrider]

Thanks Bloke, your response of the three was certainly the most helpful. I will visit our university music department and find someone who plays CC to help me.

[Reptilian]

Thanks Bloke, your response of the three was certainly the most helpful. I will visit our university music department and find someone who plays CC to help me.

...Where he/she will probably tell you something along the lines of what the first two posters said...

All three posts were quite excellent (if you're of the thinking type, that is) and it will most likely come down to an out of tune horn (within itself) that will have to be tuned to error on the side of the notes that are most easily accessible to the top slides available and maybe against frequency of use (ie low G vs the D above it).

[Roger Lewis]

As a good place to start, go here and click on the "Tuning" link:

http://www.uni.edu/drfun/articles/index.html" target="_blank

Dr. Funderburk has a pretty good starting point for setting the horn up to get it close to playable. This will get you in the ball park but may not be your final set up.

Good luck.

Roger

[aqualung]

Your problem is probably not you or the horn, but trying to play a CC in tune with a typical 40-piece community band. I just went through that process last summer.

The band rehearsed at the local college, and gave me a school horn to use at the 1st rehearsal. I quickly discovered the director had unknowingly furnished me with a CC M/W. I have played Eb and BBb for many years, but this was a new experience.

The CC fingerings were not a prob, but the intonation was. Because the dominant temperament in such a group is that of Bb valved brass. I was pulling slides, running through a full repertoire of alternate fingerings, and bending pitches all night.

I never did find the magic formula. [But I did play better in tune than the clarinet section.] And thankfully at the next practice they furnished me a decent BBb Holton 345.

So keep using your King for the concert band. Use the CC for orchestra gigs, and polka bands that don't play in the flat keys.

[roughrider]

Your problem is probably not you or the horn, but trying to play a CC in tune with a typical 40-piece community band. I just went through that process last summer.

The band rehearsed at the local college, and gave me a school horn to use at the 1st rehearsal. I quickly discovered the director had unknowingly furnished me with a CC M/W. I have played Eb and BBb for many years, but this was a new experience.

The CC fingerings were not a prob, but the intonation was. Because the dominant temperament in such a group is that of Bb valved brass. I was pulling slides, running through a full repertoire of alternate fingerings, and bending pitches all night.

I never did find the magic formula. [But I did play better in tune than the clarinet section.] And thankfully at the next practice they furnished me a decent BBb Holton 345.

So keep using your King for the concert band. Use the CC for orchestra gigs, and polka bands that don't play in the flat keys.

That is exactly what I am doing now. I am playing the King and a Holton/Yamaha 4 valve BBb in Concert Band and the CC is played at home for my own amusement and surely no one else's.

[aqualung]

And thankfully at the next practice they furnished me a decent BBb Holton 345

spot-on intonation with no adjustments

I didn't say that. I know better. And so do you, and hopefully most of the people who read this forum.

But it worked better in that band than the CC. And it was my first experience playing a 345 in an ensemble environment.

As a matter of fact, I detected problems with port alignment. The horn was sent to a topnotch tech the next day, and he found that the 1st valve stem had been replaced with one of the wrong length.

[Phil Dawson]

Tuning always gets exciting - it's something even the great pro players are always working on. As instrumentalists we play in just tuning. This means that you average tuner will not be good for any key except in even tempered tuning. What may help is to play scales slowly and listen to the pitches, If you don't know your scales you need to learn them. You can then play a drone (a note held for a long time (electric keyboards work well for this) and then play the scale against the drone tonic and listen for the intonation of each not in each key. Remember that A is only 440 in the key of A. Peterson makes their stroboplus HD tuner (about $120.00 street price) that allows you to use it in Just tuning in all major and minor keys. There are also charts out there that show how many cents sharp of flat away from even tempered tuning you have to be on each note in just tuning. Learning to play well in tune in all keys is a long journey. Good luck, Phil

[aqualung]

Very well stated, Phil. Intonation is not absolute, it is relative. 99.44% of the musical world does not understand this, but still they are all experts on tuning because they own a $19.95 silicone-and-plastic gizmo (or have an app on their phone).

You write well. Please make this a separate topic, and then it would be nice if the mods would make this a sticky and keep it at the top of the page.

[Phil Dawson]

We as tuba players often are playing the root of the chord. If the root of the chord is not in tune then the other folks playing other notes in the chord don't stand a chance of playing in tune. Or on the other hand they can just ignore the out of tune root and that always sounds just great. My goal is to play everything as in tune as possible and help others (that I play with or not) to play as well in tune as possible so that we can all make better sounding music. For me one of the great things about playing music is that you can always play it better. Cheers, Phil

[roughrider]

I was pleased to receive a response from a very good local player who came by and in one hour explained and demonstrated everything that needed to be done to properly tune a CC tuba. Thanks so much to those who responded with positive suggestions and helpful ideas. I appreciated your help.