Rotating Mouthpiece affecting sound

[Andrew Pacht]

First off, I'm a high school senior looking at going to college for music ed/performance on trombone or euphonium. (Have made NYSSMA All-State on both, not sure which I want to pursue)

Anyways, I visited today and took lessons with both the trombone and euphonium professor. During my euphonium lesson, the teacher told me to move my Bach 4G mouthpiece. Not knowing what he was talking about, he told me that I need to rotate it. For some reason, when I rotated it so the "B" in Bach is pointed to the left, it produces a better and clearer sound than anywhere else. Can anyone explain to me how this happens and if they have had similar experiences with mouthpieces?

[Donn]

No, but can you clarify - different angles?

From `"B" in Bach is pointed to the left', I understand you to be saying that you only rotate the mouthpiece around in receiver. It's still pointed in the same direction, the instrument doesn't change position at all. Does that sound right?

[Andrew Pacht]

Yeah, rotating the mouthpiece, not the position. My bad

[Andrew Pacht]

No, but can you clarify - different angles?

From `"B" in Bach is pointed to the left', I understand you to be saying that you only rotate the mouthpiece around in receiver. It's still pointed in the same direction, the instrument doesn't change position at all. Does that sound right?

Yeah, rotating, and I fixed the post and topic as well.

[Dan Schultz]

...."Pocket Rocket"....

Did you get that from the 'Urban Dictionary'?

[Andrew Pacht]

One of my friends told me that there may have been a sound difference if there were tiny nicks or scratches in the horn, and maybe it's not affecting the sound if it in the certain spot.

[Donn]

I personally think the euphonium professor was pulling your leg.

[Andrew Pacht]

I personally think the euphonium professor was pulling your leg.

There's no way there would have been such a noticeable difference though.

[UDELBR]

There's no way there would have been such a noticeable difference though.

The mind is a powerful thing.

[pgym]

I personally think the euphonium professor was pulling your leg.

There's no way there would have been such a noticeable difference though.

Sure there is: it's called confirmation bias.

The practice of rotating a mouthpiece to find the "optimal orientation" is commonly referred to as "mouthpiece clocking."

Although there MAY be circumstances in which mouthpiece clocking makes a real difference (such as an out-of-round or eccentric shank or receiver), it is much more likely that it simply illustrates the truth of the old saying,"If you go looking for trouble, eventually you'll find it": a player who expects rotating his mouthpiece to make a difference will eventually PERCEIVE a difference, whether or not there actually IS a difference.

[swillafew]

College is a great place for practical jokes. If your playing was improving, you were doing a good job in the lesson, and a little fun was had at your expense.

[Dan Schultz]

College is a great place for practical jokes. If your playing was improving, you were doing a good job in the lesson, and a little fun was had at your expense.

Sort of like the military. The favorite Navy prank was to send a recruit looking for a bucket of relative bearing grease.

[Eflatdoubler]

The pocket rocket is really available for instruments. I remember reading about it and saw the horn guys had one at their shop...

Many people do believe in "mouthpiece clocking". Perhaps a bit of a placebo affect, and maybe slight variances in the mouthpiece in regard to the shank or even how clean it is inside!
Sometimes the rim feels better at the contact points due to inconsistent manufacturing.

[Kevin Hendrick]

Trumpet forum thread on mouthpiece clocking. It may be voodoo, but apparently it's popular voodoo.

That's an interesting thread. Noticed a couple of things:

(1) Some referred to rotating the 'piece so the stamped/engraved name was up, which seems to indicate that this might be a bit of a clock-up.

(2) A few mentioned bent mouthpieces (whether accidentally or intentionally) -- are they telling us to go get bent?

[Rick F]

College is a great place for practical jokes. If your playing was improving, you were doing a good job in the lesson, and a little fun was had at your expense.

Sort of like the military. The favorite Navy prank was to send a recruit looking for a bucket of relative bearing grease.

In the Air Force, (electronics during the vacuum tube era), the sarge might send you to get a fallopian tube.

[hbcrandy]

Your sound quality is not dependent on mouthpiece position in the receiver anymore than it is dependent on the phase of the moon or sun spots. Your sound is dependent on you based on your physical stamina and the sound concept you have in your head.

A close freind of mine who is a free-lance trumpet player in the Washington, D. C. area was doing a master class in Las Vegas when he was asked by a student attending the class, "What is the best tone intensifier (metal sleeves to put on the shank of your mouthpiece) on the market?" His answer was, "3 hours of practice per day."

My friend is correct. To improve your sound, spend much practice time each day working on relaxed, deep breathing and playing long tone scales with good sound production techniques. Other aspects of your playing such as finger technique are are also important and should be a part of your practice time budget. But, even if you have such great finger facility that you can play the Minute Waltz in 37 seconds, no one will want to listen to you if your sound is poor.

The old saying that practice makes perfect it not correct. Practice makes permanent. Perfect practice makes perfect. Put in a lot of QUALITY practice time. There are NO short cuts.

[pgym]

College is a great place for practical jokes. If your playing was improving, you were doing a good job in the lesson, and a little fun was had at your expense.

Assuming the suggestion was made in jest.

Apparently, Wayne Tanabe (see here and here and the late Wayne Dyess (longtime professor of trombone and director of jazz studies at Lamar Univ) (see here and here advocate(d) the practice.

[TubaRay]

With all the above discussion, I'd be interested in seeing a scientific explanation, if one exists. Count me as a non-believer.

[swillafew]

[eutubabone]

to quote Inspector Clouseau" Ahh, now we're getting somewhere!" ( Interogating the help scene from Pink Panther).