Someday... (2)

Cameron Gates · Post by **Cameron Gates** » Sat Jul 12, 2014 8:36 pm

I wanna Thein. Never played, seen, or heard one. It has to be the best ever.

THE TUBA · Post by **THE TUBA** » Sat Jul 12, 2014 10:05 pm

Thein horns look real neat. It would be cool to have enough disposable income to buy an expensive toy because it looks neat. Owning a Thein signifies that I would already own several more practical instruments.

Dan Schultz · Post by **Dan Schultz** » Sat Jul 12, 2014 10:15 pm

One day I want to own a Rudy 6/4 BBb. When that day comes... I'll probably not even be able to lift it.

Of course... I also have no sense at all.

Donn · Post by **Donn** » Sat Jul 12, 2014 10:23 pm

Curmudgeon wrote:I'm hoping to one day own a tuba made from cheese.

One day, heck I bet you could make it last a couple weeks if you have room in the refrigerator.

Donn · Post by **Donn** » Sun Jul 13, 2014 1:26 am

Better in what way? Just because they call it "string cheese" doesn't mean you can tune it to standard guitar tuning.

iiipopes · Post by **iiipopes** » Sun Jul 13, 2014 6:01 pm

OK, I need help to find a picture and the name of a maufacturer. A few years ago, I found on the internet a small independent one-man shop that made mostly corno-di-caccia instruments. He made a CC tuba that had the rotors in a zig-zag pattern instead of inline, but otherwise, a fairly conventional looking CC tuba. Because the rotors were zig-zag'ed, the overall plumbing was actually very similar to the Thein. A divorce and a computer crash later, I can't find my pictures or my references to this tuba or its maker. The tuba was probably a one-off, and I remember getting the impression from reviewing the website this was his submission for his German master's or journeyman's certificate. The reason I ask, is that it is such a great looking, and probably great playing instrument, that is what I would choose. Thanks.

gregsundt · Post by **gregsundt** » Sun Jul 13, 2014 7:53 pm

I don't guess I'm the only one who wants his Rudy back? I let it go too easily, and missed it ever since.

bort · Post by **bort** » Sun Jul 13, 2014 10:08 pm

gregsundt wrote:I don't guess I'm the only one who wants his Rudy back? I let it go too easily, and missed it ever since.

Was yours a 3/4 or 4/4?

Donn · Post by **Donn** » Sun Jul 13, 2014 10:47 pm

Someday ... I hope to own the tuba I sold?

...

I have to admit I have kind of a fetish for Kalison tubas, going a ways back to when that little 3/4 F model came out, but it would be a stretch to say I hope to own one, since I don't have any use for anything but BBb and I think $1K is a lot to pay for a used tuba.

Kevin Hendrick · Post by **Kevin Hendrick** » Mon Jul 14, 2014 3:14 am

iiipopes wrote:OK, I need help to find a picture and the name of a maufacturer. A few years ago, I found on the internet a small independent one-man shop that made mostly corno-di-caccia instruments. He made a CC tuba that had the rotors in a zig-zag pattern instead of inline, but otherwise, a fairly conventional looking CC tuba. Because the rotors were zig-zag'ed, the overall plumbing was actually very similar to the Thein. A divorce and a computer crash later, I can't find my pictures or my references to this tuba or its maker. The tuba was probably a one-off, and I remember getting the impression from reviewing the website this was his submission for his German master's or journeyman's certificate. The reason I ask, is that it is such a great looking, and probably great playing instrument, that is what I would choose. Thanks.

The website & page you're looking for (I think) is here:

http://www.kunst-brass.de/sonstiges.html

There are two pictures on that page of this tuba (front view and close-up of the valve section) -- should be the two center pics in the bottom row (click on the thumbnails for the full pics). Hope this helps!

imperialbari · Post by **imperialbari** » Mon Jul 14, 2014 8:39 am

Flush your tuba with milk directly from the cow. Don't rinse with water. And you will soon have a metal-enclosed cheese tuba.

iiipopes · Post by **iiipopes** » Mon Jul 14, 2014 10:11 am

Kevin Hendrick wrote:The website & page you're looking for (I think) is here:
http://www.kunst-brass.de/sonstiges.html
There are two pictures on that page of this tuba (front view and close-up of the valve section) -- should be the two center pics in the bottom row (click on the thumbnails for the full pics). Hope this helps!

YES! THAT'S IT! Thanks. I'm usually pretty good at google searches, since I have been doing database word searches since 1982 with Lexis, but I couldn't get this one to come up. That's it. That's the tuba I want. Thanks.

Cameron Gates · Post by **Cameron Gates** » Mon Jul 14, 2014 11:50 am

The great interst in RM horns is a bit of a head scratcher to me. I would think that most of the people who chose RM have that giant BBb in mind. The 3/4 and 5/4 are both very nice instruments and come up for sale every now and again at very reasonable prices.

Is the huge BBb the reason for all the interest?

Heck, in 1992 when I was shopping, one could buy a RM 5/4 CC from WWBW for $5000. It appeared they could not give them away at the time. Now with no big box store carrying them the interest seems to have soared.

Those 5/4's make one heck of a sound and the 3/4's are as much fun to play as a rotor HB2. But come on..!.....!...we all know that the Thein with the piston thumb valve in silver plate is THE way to go in this poll. This has to be the finest tuba ever made. Who does not want that? Once one of those horns is purchased the owner becomes a much better musician.

I stand by my vote.

Michael Bush · Post by **Michael Bush** » Mon Jul 14, 2014 12:03 pm

iiipopes wrote:
Kevin Hendrick wrote:The website & page you're looking for (I think) is here:
http://www.kunst-brass.de/sonstiges.html
There are two pictures on that page of this tuba (front view and close-up of the valve section) -- should be the two center pics in the bottom row (click on the thumbnails for the full pics). Hope this helps!
YES! THAT'S IT! Thanks. I'm usually pretty good at google searches, since I have been doing database word searches since 1982 with Lexis, but I couldn't get this one to come up. That's it. That's the tuba I want. Thanks.

Why is this not a good idea? I always assume businesses are pretty good at figuring out what will make money, so I figure if this was a viable product someone would be producing it. But it it seems intuitively like a good idea. Maybe too little resistance? Or is it just that it's weird-looking?

joh_tuba · Post by **joh_tuba** » Mon Jul 14, 2014 12:42 pm

I'm not sure there's a significant practical difference from the viewpoint of a sound wave traveling through the bugle.

All paths through a traditional rotor equal a 90 degree change in direction.. It's the nature of the beast.

The practical affect is the same number of 90 degree turns in essentially the same places.

Noteworthy that it has the rotary PT style 90 degree entry into the valve section.

iiipopes · Post by **iiipopes** » Mon Jul 14, 2014 1:06 pm

If the path through the rotor "open" is 90 degrees, rather than "straight," as on conventional rotary instruments, then the airflow can approach the same resistance as the rotor going "through" the valve circuit. That's what I like about the design: it seems to equalize the overall resistance between open and having valves engaged, so, theoretically, there is more consistency of response throughout the instrument.

joh_tuba · Post by **joh_tuba** » Mon Jul 14, 2014 3:36 pm

The traditional 'straight' rotor arrangement gives the illusion of a straight path but if you look at the angle of entry and exit of the knuckles they are all basically 90 degrees. The connecting bits between each valve is just another 90 turn around. It's definitely NOT a straight shot through the valve block. There's actually a fair amount of 'resistance' already built into the system.

IF we want to get a little bit more nerdy about this.. what the zig-zag pattern is really doing is replacing the connecting bits between each valve with another valve.. The net affect of a zig-zag valve section is to *reduce* the total number of zig-zags. Now that I think about it.. I'll admit I was a too quick to dismiss it as not being different. BUT, once the valve is engaged this design still ads an additional 90 degree turn.. there is no way around that. It's possible that this horn actually has *more* differences in response when valves are engaged.

A straight five rotor tuba with no valves engaged by my reckoning has nine 90 degree turns. This tuba has five 90 degree turns. Engaging a valve adds one additional turn either way. So... it's the difference between going 9 to 10 vs 5 to 6. Maybe that is worth it?

Billy M. · Post by **Billy M.** » Fri Jul 18, 2014 12:06 am

iiipopes wrote:
Kevin Hendrick wrote:The website & page you're looking for (I think) is here:
http://www.kunst-brass.de/sonstiges.html
There are two pictures on that page of this tuba (front view and close-up of the valve section) -- should be the two center pics in the bottom row (click on the thumbnails for the full pics). Hope this helps!
YES! THAT'S IT! Thanks. I'm usually pretty good at google searches, since I have been doing database word searches since 1982 with Lexis, but I couldn't get this one to come up. That's it. That's the tuba I want. Thanks.

Considering it has string rotors... I don't think I'd be interested in the extra maintenance this horn would require.

I still want an Alex....

iiipopes · Post by **iiipopes** » Fri Jul 18, 2014 9:03 pm

bloke wrote:String linkage (particularly with that bulletproof string that Yamaha buys and resells) is silent and stays maintenance-free for years.

Indeed. And if it does break, I learned how to re-string rotors when I played french horn for a year in college concert band, just to see what it was all about. Braided fly fishing line is also very strong and does not stretch, making a good linkage cable, and is readily available to me since I live just a few miles from Bass Pro Shops.

TubeNet

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