Tuba Urban Legends

KarlMarx · Post by **KarlMarx** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 8:58 am

bloke wrote:#2 "Anvil-weighted mouthpieces work better than normal mouthpieces."

How dare you challenge my Evangelium, you doggish heretic?

Carolus Marximus Profundamentale

KarlMarx · Post by **KarlMarx** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 9:03 am

Shockwave wrote:Tuba players drink a lot

If so, would that constitute a real problem?

Most of them appear to be severely braindamaged anyway.

Carolus Marximus Exceptionalis ad hesum Materiae

KarlMarx · Post by **KarlMarx** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 9:15 am

bloke wrote:Tuba players fart chronically, can't sightread unless there is a quarter rest in between each note (no more than three flats in the key signature, and no higher than the second line in the staff), smile all the time because that's about all they know how to do, and drive vehicles that no one else was dumb enough to buy...

JosÃ©, you ain't that far off on this one!

Only you missed out on the plentiful sad "no higher than the second line in the staff"-types, which don't really feel comfortable below the F at bottom of the staff.

Carolus Octaviae Plentiphones

KarlMarx · Post by **KarlMarx** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 9:20 am

Jared wrote:pulling a valve slide without pressing the valve down ruins it.

The slide?

Carolus Marximus Mystificantus

KarlMarx · Post by **KarlMarx** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 9:35 am

brianf wrote:A York Master is a York!

They ain't, which however doesn't prevent the upper end versions from being good.

brianf wrote:Finally, a new one yesterday in Athens "Play this horn" - a so-called York copy with paper and tape over the label. During this Vince pulls out his cell phone pretending to make a call then snaps a picture of me. Will he put the pix on the Tuba Exchange website under the heading "Look who's playing a St Petersburg?" BEWARE!!!

Not all exchanges will stock your portfolio (portefeuille in all real languages)!

Brian, you are the real Marximus!

Carolus, staying with the short version as a bow towards the Master of the York trademark.

TexTuba · Post by **TexTuba** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 9:45 am

I have to say that all tuba players are NOT happy go lucky. Most that I've met are, but boy I've met some that make trumpet players seem modest.

Ralph

MaryAnn · Post by **MaryAnn** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 10:01 am

mandrake wrote:
tubaman5150 wrote:Tuba's [sic.] have to play ahead of the beat because the size of the tuba makes the sound late.
I don't know which tubas you've been playing. I certainly have to rush occasionally in order to play in time. Perhaps there is another reason?

I've found two concepts out there in players, and one concept puts them behind the beat, and the other puts them right on it.

The "late" concept is the player starts to physically play the note "on" the beat. The sound comes out the bell too late.

The "on time" concept is the player does whatever is necessary physically to hear his sound come out the bell "on" the beat. The sound is not behind the beat.

MA, who has had to teach horn players this, and who wishes these simple things were taught more often in the schools

Edit: This sounds kind of like I'm slamming you which is not the intent at all...just making a general answer to your honest query.

Uncle Buck · Post by **Uncle Buck** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 10:08 am

More valves = better tuba. (I've known people to take a great-sounding 4-valve CC and make it into a stuffy-sounding 5-valve. The tuning trigger idea Jim Self and Lee Stofer used on that York restoration seems a better solution to me.)

tubeast · Post by **tubeast** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 10:13 am

Yes, Mary Ann, great comment. Imagine what a cymbal player does to play on the beat. Imagine him playing a little "tsling-tslang-tsling" as opposed to that huge crash when he has to fear to ruin the things. I guess it is the same, just not quite as obvious, on any instrument. The preparation may take longer than the note itself.

tubaman5150 · Post by **tubaman5150** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 11:41 am

MaryAnn wrote:
mandrake wrote:
tubaman5150 wrote:Tuba's [sic.] have to play ahead of the beat because the size of the tuba makes the sound late.
I don't know which tubas you've been playing. I certainly have to rush occasionally in order to play in time. Perhaps there is another reason?
I've found two concepts out there in players, and one concept puts them behind the beat, and the other puts them right on it.

The "late" concept is the player starts to physically play the note "on" the beat. The sound comes out the bell too late.

The "on time" concept is the player does whatever is necessary physically to hear his sound come out the bell "on" the beat. The sound is not behind the beat.

MA, who has had to teach horn players this, and who wishes these simple things were taught more often in the schools

Edit: This sounds kind of like I'm slamming you which is not the intent at all...just making a general answer to your honest query.

This is what I was referring to earlier. Whenever I hear of a tuba player that sounds behind (other than just bad time), its usually due improper articulation.
I think the tongue has to move a millisecond before the attack is made to be on time. I don't teach students to think about this because they exagerate it too much. Instead, I teach them to make sure their embouchure is set, they tongue quickly and solidly, and the use good air pressure. The brain will automatically adjust the timing.
I've heard many band directors say, "Tubas are behind. They need to play ahead to sound in time". What they really need say is, "Tubas are behind. They need to use better articulation and subdivide the beat".

Wilco · Post by **Wilco** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 12:19 pm

basstrombone takes more air than tuba

Rick Denney · Post by **Rick Denney** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 12:28 pm

Tuba prices are based only on what it costs to make them.

Rick "who is afraid of 16th notes" Denney

MaryAnn · Post by **MaryAnn** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 2:33 pm

tubeast wrote:Yes, Mary Ann, great comment. Imagine what a cymbal player does to play on the beat. Imagine him playing a little "tsling-tslang-tsling" as opposed to that huge crash when he has to fear to ruin the things. I guess it is the same, just not quite as obvious, on any instrument. The preparation may take longer than the note itself.

Well... we actually HAD a drummer in the brass band who did exactly that: he started his stroke on the beat. It was maddening. I can't imagine that he did not hear what he was doing, but he didn't. If I had been the conductor I would have had his rear back on trombone where he came from, instantly. I did talk to him once at the very begninning (very nice guy, just clueless) and suggested that maybe he was starting his stroke on the beat, and gave him the concept that he needed to actually hear the drum on the beat, instead. He did try but had been doing it the other way for too long. Fortunately...he ran out of time to play in the band. Whew.

MA

MaryAnn · Post by **MaryAnn** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 2:37 pm

tubaman5150 wrote:I think the tongue has to move a millisecond before the attack is made to be on time. I don't teach students to think about this because they exagerate it too much.

Yes! This is about the only topic I've run into where I would say "analysis is paralysis." Usually I lament that teachers will not give enough technical info when a student has a problem. In this instance....if I had to mentally "plan" how long before I needed to hear the sound, to start my articulation, I'd go nuts. Just using the ear to hear when the sound is, and fixing it, seems the only way to go. It is an attention focus issue, not a technique issue. You focus on when you hear the sound, not how you get there. The "how" should occur naturally.

MA, who is amazed she is suddenly in the other camp re "analysis"

Lew · Post by **Lew** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 2:53 pm

Jonathantuba wrote: Tubas mostly play Om-pah
...

Everyone knows that tubas only play the Oom, it's left to the French horns to play the Pah.

hurricane_harry · Post by **hurricane_harry** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 4:34 pm

heres one, tuba playing WILL get you laid

as to the play ahead of the beat issue.
as my sofmore year of high school began we played a piece called "the rise and fall of rome" by key poulan, perhaps some of you are firmilar with his work and his had on for astinatos. well anyways we (the tubas) rather than play with the conductor and get yelled at by the whole band, chose to play with the tempo our peers were giving us. our woodwind instructor had this same thing in his head and had us drilling this astinata for about half an hour playing aherad of the beat and we either dragged or rushed when attempted to do so, eventually i said to myself 'screw this' and played with the metronome and played it perfectly on beat. perhaps one would need to start playing early due to the physics, but after about a month on tuba i've never had any real problem with dragging because i got to know my horn.

and one more for the road, tuba players never practice

tubeast · Post by **tubeast** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 5:01 pm

Hurricane harry, of course tuba players donÂ´t practise.
We have this piece of essential knowledge here in Germany that IÂ´d like to share:
"Wer uebt, kann nix. Wer nich uebt, kann morng auch nix."
(to those studying German out there: DonÂ´t doubt your textbook, this is colloquial spelling!!)
Translation attempt: "You practise, you suck. You donÂ´t practise, you suck tomorrow"

Have fun

Hans

ZACH336 · Post by **ZACH336** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 5:15 pm

A myth that german horns sound bright and american horns sound dark.

Complete opposite imo the german horns always have had a very dark sound and the american horns a puffy fuzzy unfocused sound not dark at all.

Lew · Post by **Lew** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 6:16 pm

bloke wrote:
I'm like a good Mirafone - 1960's vintage.

me?...I'm like an impossible-to-play-in-tune 1950's vintage Holton, Alex, or Cerveny...

Me too. I think that's why I like my Martin, it was born the same year as me, 1956.

Rick Denney · Post by **Rick Denney** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 6:20 pm

ZACH336 wrote:...the american horns a puffy fuzzy unfocused sound not dark at all.

Myth: American-style horns have a puffy, fuzzy and unfocused sound.

Rick "who doesn't doubt that some players have a puffy, fuzzy, and unfocused sound" Denney