F, C, Bb Tuba?

[sflathers92705]

I just joined these forums and my biggest question is for auditions is there a specific key of Tuba that they want to see? I am looking to buy a professional grade Tuba in hopes of joining a Southern California orchestra, is there a specific key of tuba the adductors will want to see? Thanks

[opus37]

There isn't a simple answer for your question. The tuba key that seems to work best for orchestras is C. However, they are looking for good tone, technical skill, musicality and blending with the rest of the group. You have to take into account the group's skill level, size and music preferences. By the way, you forgot an Eb.

[sflathers92705]

Thanks for your reply. I have been playing Tuba all throughout high school and college on Bb horn and so obviously the Bb is my forte, but when I went to order my Tuba they asked if I was sure I wanted a Bb, and then I began to question if I wanted the Bb. So are there any specific things that make the C tuba more desirable in an orchestra? I was told by one of my mentors that it was just because it can go lower, but I would love to know any other reasons.

[NickIngrþoe]

The C tuba can't go lower than the BBb... Unless your BBb is 3 valve, in which case it is. If both are 4/5 valve then the deepness of their registers is excessive anyway, so I wouldn't worry about that.

While this is a controversial subject among tuba players, a CC tuba is generally preferred because it's sound is more blending and sort of smoother, whereas the BBb is more muddy... However it will very from piece to piece which tuba is better, as some pieces (especially German ones), demand either BBbs or CC. Personally I prefer the CC, but at the end of the day it's probably down to you... Also it depends what the trombone players have I think...

[Dubby]

Thanks for your reply. I have been playing Tuba all throughout high school and college on Bb horn and so obviously the Bb is my forte, but when I went to order my Tuba they asked if I was sure I wanted a Bb, and then I began to question if I wanted the Bb. So are there any specific things that make the C tuba more desirable in an orchestra? I was told by one of my mentors that it was just because it can go lower, but I would love to know any other reasons.

Where were you planning on buying your tuba that they asked if you were sure on BBb? To answer your first question though, BBb or CC or F buy what you sound the best on and can comfortably play. The audition committee won't notice what key it's in most likely; rather they'll notice your sound and musicality.

[Tom]

Assuming this is a real post and not a total troll...

If you're buying one tuba that you need to use for everything and you're going to play in bands and orchestras, get yourself a contrabass tuba (BBb or CC), not an F tuba or Eb tuba which, at least in the United States, are "special purpose" instrument that are usually acquired AFTER a contrabass. F and Eb tubas are not used as the only or primary tuba in a band or orchestra in the United States; sure, you can play F or Eb in band or orchestra but it will not be the volume, breadth, and type of sound that really suits that application and is probably not what the ensemble or director expects as their tuba sound.

And, nobody needs to switch to CC from BBb to play in an orchestra. You seem to have been unaware of them and/or had no interest in switching until you went to buy a BBb tuba and the salesman questioned your decision. If that is the case, don't get yourself a CC tuba thinking that you "need" it to be in or even audition for an orchestra.

My suggestion would be for you to either buy the BBb tuba that you were planning on buying (since you apparently did try to order something, yes?) or BUY NOTHING right now. Keep learning and keep playing what you've got until you have a better idea of what it is that you actually want to do. It doesn't really sound like you know yet.

Regarding the "goes lower" comment on CC tubas - no. Generally speaking, your range will be your range on whatever key tuba you buy. CC tubas these days usually have 5 valves - that's more fingering OPTIONS for use throughout the range, not automatic low register "goes lower" buttons. Either your mentor is confused or you misunderstood what they were trying to tell you. If you don't have a tuba teacher, do that before you buy anything.

[Donn]

Where were you planning on buying your tuba

Now there's a good question. You were going to mail order a tuba? You're in California? I have a hunch many orchestra players pick out a tuba in person. I'm pretty sure that's a possibility within California.

[opus37]

Assuming this is a real post and not a total troll...

If you're buying one tuba that you need to use for everything and you're going to play in bands and orchestras, get yourself a contrabass tuba (BBb or CC), not an F tuba or Eb tuba which, at least in the United States, are "special purpose" instrument that are usually acquired AFTER a contrabass. F and Eb tubas are not used as the only or primary tuba in a band or orchestra in the United States; sure, you can play F or Eb in band or orchestra but it will not be the volume, breadth, and type of sound that really suits that application and is probably not what the ensemble or director expects as their tuba sound.

And, nobody needs to switch to CC from BBb to play in an orchestra. You seem to have been unaware of them and/or had no interest in switching until you went to buy a BBb tuba and the salesman questioned your decision. If that is the case, don't get yourself a CC tuba thinking that you "need" it to be in or even audition for an orchestra.

My suggestion would be for you to either buy the BBb tuba that you were planning on buying (since you apparently did try to order something, yes?) or BUY NOTHING right now. Keep learning and keep playing what you've got until you have a better idea of what it is that you actually want to do. It doesn't really sound like you know yet.

Regarding the "goes lower" comment on CC tubas - no. Generally speaking, your range will be your range on whatever key tuba you buy. CC tubas these days usually have 5 valves - that's more fingering OPTIONS for use throughout the range, not automatic low register "goes lower" buttons. Either your mentor is confused or you misunderstood what they were trying to tell you. If you don't have a tuba teacher, do that before you buy anything.

We have a basic disagreement on whether an F or Eb is a special purpose horn and that they do not have the sound expected. There have been several threads on this net about a "do it all tuba". An Eb fits that role for a lot of players. For the New York Philharmonic or some other major orchestra, I would agree with you. In this case, it is likely an amateur group and likely a small one. An F or Eb could be just fine for the group. The most important things that I think we agree on is he should stick with what he is comfortable with and can play well. We also agree on range and he should discuss this with a competent tuba instructor.

[The Big Ben]

I just joined these forums and my biggest question is for auditions is there a specific key of Tuba that they want to see? I am looking to buy a professional grade Tuba in hopes of joining a Southern California orchestra, is there a specific key of tuba the adductors will want to see? Thanks

If you are in SoCal, go see Steve Ferguson at "The Horn Guys". They have a store in LaCresenda and in Long Beach.

Face to face with a good guy will give you more information quicker than a dozen comments from the TNFJ. Call and make an appointment.
http://www.hornguys.com" target="_blank

[Michael Bush]

I am biting my tongue.

But if I were not, I'd be asking what OP's other user name is. Because this post reads for all the world like the work of a troll.

[greenbean]

Here come those Santa Ana winds again...

[sflathers92705]

Well thanks to all those with the serious advice. I think it has helped me with my decision. I have been in a high school wind ensemble for my whole high school career and have been in several different marching bands, all of which used the BBb tuba, and until the salesman questioned my decision. I have never even ventured off the Bb tuba, and playing it got me into the Rose Parade Honor Band, so yes, the Bb tuba works for me best. My main concern was whether or not orchestras will mind the Bb tuba in their group. I am ordering the Tuba custom directly from the Kanstul instruments factory in Anaheim, and it was the sales manager there who questioned my decision, but I think that the post from you all have helped me come to a final decision. I am going to go with a 5-valve BBb 4/4 sized Kanstul tuba! Thank you all again!

[sflathers92705]

In addition to this, although its on a different topic, I have yet to read anything on the Kanstul line of tubas? I mainly like them because they're american made and hand made, and have the same "live alloy" bell that was used on the old York tubas. But not seeing anything about them on the forums has made me nervous... are these Tubas good or bad? Thanks again!

[Jess Haney]

The C tuba can't go lower than the BBb... Unless your BBb is 3 valve, in which case it is. If both are 4/5 valve then the deepness of their registers is excessive anyway, so I wouldn't worry about that.

While this is a controversial subject among tuba players, a CC tuba is generally preferred because it's sound is more blending and sort of smoother, whereas the BBb is more muddy... However it will very from piece to piece which tuba is better, as some pieces (especially German ones), demand either BBbs or CC. Personally I prefer the CC, but at the end of the day it's probably down to you... Also it depends what the trombone players have I think...

I think to call the sound of BBb "muddy" is an inaccurate concept of BBb vs CC. When I listen to recordings I cant tell the difference of CC to BBb. A good player sounds great on any horn. No key is superior to the other. Personal preference plays the game with this one. Follow the good advice and go try horns out before you buy. Keep in mind with a new key comes transposition.

[eupher61]

Don't worry about the adductors, they're just a bunch of muscleheads.

As for which tuba, who cares? Only you, and the mAsses who claim you have to play one key or another.

[swillafew]

If Kanstul is what you want, they make an Eb tuba that I would look at myself if I needed to go to one horn. And I don't even play Eb...

[Donn]

Are there those who believe that zinc and tin are the same thing?

No.

[ArnoldGottlieb]

I think Kantstul makes great tubas. Last time I played in SoCal, I visited the factory and played all of their horns. They were all really great. My favorite was the travel tuba, which as I'm starting to travel a bit less I don't need. They all played great with a tuner and had really nice resonance. I could easily have a career on any of their 4/4 horns.

In addition to this, although its on a different topic, I have yet to read anything on the Kanstul line of tubas? I mainly like them because they're american made and hand made, and have the same "live alloy" bell that was used on the old York tubas. But not seeing anything about them on the forums has made me nervous... are these Tubas good or bad? Thanks again!

[Worth]

Here come those Santa Ana winds again...

Babylon Sisters Shake It

[Rick Denney]

Anybody under the age of 25 does not need a "specialty instrument", unless they have professional aspirations and are under the care of a high-end teacher. In which case, they don't need advice here.

Anybody majoring in tuba performance will have to be able to play all keys with some facility. The guys who spend their whole academic careers playing C tubas and find themselves operating a Bb sousaphone for a military ceremonial band know what I mean. And they will struggle with solo performances without having a bass tuba in the stable. But those guys also do not need advice here.

Except for the above, by a Bb tuba and call it a day. When and if you want to, and can do it with your own money, add a bass tuba in Eb or F. But a contrabass will be more useful in bands and amateur orchestras. Bands require the tuba player to be a utility bass more than a color instrument, and small amateur orchestras often need the tuba player to double the string basses for reinforcement.

But choice of instrument has nothing to do with actually being accepted by an orchestra, and that's true even with amateur orchestras.

Don't get advice from sellers without first getting advice from teachers. Sellers/manufacturers make more money on the sorts of C tubas they might sell to college kids, because C tubas fetch higher prices. But the C tubas they have available for sale might be better tubas, too. You won't know which without close guidance.

Rick "'ask your teacher' always used to be the standard response for threads like this" Denney