Concert Black Dress Shoes

[Three Valves]

I have two pair of black dress shoes I use for performances. I have owned both pairs for about 25 years and it is time to get a new pair. I don't mind paying a premium for a really good pair of shoes. The old ones are Florasheim and Johnson & Murphy.

I would like to move from a leather sole to a rubber. I need more traction on and off stage when hauling tubas.

Any suggestions?

Are you wearing a tux??

[Uncle Buck]

Some of you Hippies may hang with the "if it feels good, do it" crowd but not me!!

Not to beat a dead horse or continue to veer this thread off topic, but I'm still trying to understand your opposition to wearing bluchers with a tuxedo. Are you saying that the shoes on the two links below would be inappropriate? Both are bluchers.

http://www.dillards.com/p/Cole-Haan-Cam ... fgodP4QCbg

http://www.zappos.com/massimo-matteo-3- ... 12203148:s

[Three Valves]

Of course it's wrong...

A Patent Balmoral is correct.

http://www.brooksbrothers.com/Black-Pat ... &cgid=0522" target="_blank

And $400 for a nice formal UK made proper shoe ain't bad!!

Now if one isn't performing, an opera pump would be OK.

[tofu]

Some folks say you can wear velvet slippers with a tux. Do 99% of people really care? I doubt it.

I often have this discussion with the younger associates in my firm all the time. That no matter how the client is dressed we are always dressed better and to a certain standard. It's about respect to the client and in this case the audience. I would have to disagree with your statement that velvet slippers would be acceptable with a tux and that 99% of people would not care. They might not verbalize it, but don't kid yourself that it would go unnoticed or noted by both the audience and fellow musicians. It's also disrespectful to your colleagues on stage if they are all dressed to a certain standard and one guy is wearing slippers. And once that is allowed you can be sure other things will soon follow - maybe even tux pant cutoffs.

Certainly different groups and types of music have all kinds of acceptable dress, but if your group is wearing tuxes and has a dress code you can't allow somebody to randomly go off the reservation.

[Three Valves]

In summery;

If you want to look like someone that doesn't care, where what you want.

If you want to look like someone who knows how to look and gives a damn,

wear the right thing!!

[Three Valves]

http://www.thefineyounggentleman.com/bl ... th-tuxedo/" target="_blank

Sartorial advice from a man with a pony tail??

[Uncle Buck]

I guess there's two debates going on here. I agree with most of the last three points.

There is one, narrow, point that I still think is BS: the argument that bluchers aren't appropriate with a tuxedo. One board member here says they aren't.

I haven't seen anything saying bluchers aren't OK anywhere other than one poster in this thread. I just did a quick internet search (not gonna post anymore links), but it appears Nordstroms, Joseph A. Bank, and Business Insider all have guidelines on what they consider appropriate shoes with a black tuxedo (some more detailed than others), and none of them express one word of disapproval for bluchers.

So, I stand my my vary narrow point: I don't see any basis for the allegation that bluchers don't go with a tux.

[FarahShazam]

**removes administrator hat**

http://www.thefineyounggentleman.com/bl ... th-tuxedo/" target="_blank

Sartorial advice from a man with a pony tail??

The heck is wrong with you? You're a nice guy usually. I'm hoping you're just being fun-snarky.

[Uncle Buck]

**removes administrator hat**

http://www.thefineyounggentleman.com/bl ... th-tuxedo/" target="_blank

Sartorial advice from a man with a pony tail??

The heck is wrong with you? You're a nice guy usually. I'm hoping you're just being fun-snarky.

I think he was referring to the author of the fashion blog Stryk posted, not to Stryk.

[Donn]

Even if some certified authority can be found who would declare a Blucher (whatever that is) unsuitable for black tie, tofu introduces a key point, for a performer it's the dress code that counts. Fashion standards like X goes with black tie are not something that should be your concern for essentially a costume.

[Three Valves]

I think he was referring to the author of the fashion blog Stryk posted, not to Stryk.

YES!!

[Three Valves]

Fashion standards like X goes with black tie are not something that should be your concern for essentially a costume.

Correct.

Tuxedos are for swells at parties or the opera.

As a uniform, its use should be reconsidered.

Our band had a navy suit for concert and we threw on a bib for marching.

In that case, plain black military style bluchers were preferred.

With spats, naturally.

[Three Valves]

So, I stand my my vary narrow point: I don't see any basis for the allegation that bluchers don't go with a tux.

Wholecut Balmoral – This is an uncommon style, wherein the uppers are a single piece of unbroken leather. A single slit is cut down from the opening and punched with eyelets for the laces. It looks quite sleek, and suits a tuxedo well.
Plain-Toe Balmoral – This is your basic high-formality business dress shoe. “Balmoral” implies that the lacing system is closed — that is, the piece of leather containing the eyelets is sewn directly into the upper of the shoe, not laid on top. That makes the top smooth and even, which is preferred for black tie attire.
Cap-Toe Balmoral – The same as a basic balmoral, but with the toe stitched onto the uppers, creating a horizontal line across the top about an inch back from the toe. It is a common business style, but bordering on too informal for black tie. Pair it with the more relaxed shawl collar, rather than peaked lapels.
Plain-Toe Blucher – Also called derbies, bluchers have an open lacing system, meaning that the pieces of leather containing the eyelets are separate from the uppers, and layered on top of them. Black tie has begun to tolerate the intrusion of these lower-formality shoes in the last few decades, but they are decidedly less impressive than your other options.

http://www.artofmanliness.com/2013/12/1 ... ar-tuxedo/" target="_blank

Just because the Hippies have taken over doesn't mean that bluchers, even very nice ones, are OK with a tuxedo!!

[Three Valves]

It also says you should wear a thin dress watch, if you wear one at all. I am a lost cause, because no one is going to take the Sea Dweller off my wrist.

We can thank James Bond for that one!!

If memory serves, however, he emerged from a dive, in a drysuit with a tux underneath and his Rolex intact.

Thunderball??

[FarahShazam]

I figured that. I wasn't aware that hairstyle is a qualifier for shoe wearers. *snark*

[Donn]

Tuxedos are for swells at parties or the opera.

As a uniform, its use should be reconsidered.

It can hardly be a uniform - seems to me it varies too much. Different collar styles, mainly, but I'm sure there's more if you know what to look for.

My term was "costume." It's a type of dress associated with various things, including dress-up music performance. Some men may also wear them in social occasions where fashion issues could be real important, but that doesn't mean the fashion conscious should get excited every time someone puts on a tuxedo. As a garment, it should be better looking than coveralls, and for some of us that's enough of a challenge right there.

[Rick Denney]

It can hardly be a uniform - seems to me it varies too much. Different collar styles, mainly, but I'm sure there's more if you know what to look for.

My term was "costume." It's a type of dress associated with various things, including dress-up music performance. Some men may also wear them in social occasions where fashion issues could be real important, but that doesn't mean the fashion conscious should get excited every time someone puts on a tuxedo. As a garment, it should be better looking than coveralls, and for some of us that's enough of a challenge right there.

If I'm wearing a dinner jacket for a social occasion, the patent-leather black shoes might be more appropriate. If I'm leading a swing band at the Copacabana in 1954, likewise. If I'm dancing in a movie with Ginger Rogers, you betcha.

But for "costume" wear on stage, particularly when I had to schlepp my tuba from the back edge of the parking lot, I will wear shoes that are comfortable and unobtrusive. For me, those are the same shoes I wear with a suit, when black shoes and belt are what seems appropriate that day. At present, those are Johnston & Murphy Aristocrafts, which in the year mine were made were very nice, but they are certainly not patent leather or intended for wear with a dinner jacket.

The OP specified a preference for rubber soles, and that's why I recommended the Allen Edmonds Wilbert line. They are not really dressy, but they are well made and comfortable, and given the stage-wear I see from many young'uns these days, they will exude class. From a distance, the cap-toe design will not look wrong, though the thick soles will not impress Ginger. I have all too often seen tuxedos that were poorly fitted, wrinkled and unpressed. And then they button the jacket--a no-no with dinner jackets, tailcoats and morning coats. And I've seen young'uns use the plastic studs that came with the shirt--or, worse, the buttons, and inappropriate cuff links for the costume application. Even musicians can wear appropriate shirt studs and cuff links, it seems to me. The black sneakers are the most visible sin, and I've seen those, too.

My first musician tux was from Barry Manufacturing, and was made from sheets of plastic with a weave pattern molded into them. But at least I was wearing appropriate shoes.

Rick "whose current tux is a bit better" Denney

[Donn]

The OP specified a preference for rubber soles, and that's why I recommended the Allen Edmonds Wilbert line. They are not really dressy, but they are well made and comfortable, and given the stage-wear I see from many young'uns these days, they will exude class. From a distance, the cap-toe design will not look wrong, though the thick soles will not impress Ginger.

Well ... unless I got the wrong picture when I looked them up, it would have to be from a pretty long distance. To my way of thinking that's more of a moccasin toe than a cap toe. If it's OK with everyone it's OK, but then I guess the same goes for black sneakers. I think there's something to be said for dressing everyone in black turtlenecks, which would go well with the sneakers (but wouldn't go very well with the average American physique.) Allen Edmonds appears to make dressier shoes with rubber soles (or "foam rubber EVA" which I guess would not really be rubber.)

[Rick Denney]

The OP specified a preference for rubber soles, and that's why I recommended the Allen Edmonds Wilbert line. They are not really dressy, but they are well made and comfortable, and given the stage-wear I see from many young'uns these days, they will exude class. From a distance, the cap-toe design will not look wrong, though the thick soles will not impress Ginger.

Well ... unless I got the wrong picture when I looked them up, it would have to be from a pretty long distance. To my way of thinking that's more of a moccasin toe than a cap toe. If it's OK with everyone it's OK, but then I guess the same goes for black sneakers. I think there's something to be said for dressing everyone in black turtlenecks, which would go well with the sneakers (but wouldn't go very well with the average American physique.) Allen Edmonds appears to make dressier shoes with rubber soles (or "foam rubber EVA" which I guess would not really be rubber.)

No, they are a moccasin toe. But they do not look like sneakers, either. I certainly wouldn't wear them with a tux, but I was working to a specification.

Rick "who doesn't wear patent leather, however" Denney