Curious Question About Breathing....

[corbasse]

It's probably just your throat you're not keeping open enough. Have you tried breathing through a cardboard tube? Get a used toilet paper roll, or even just a sheet of paper you roll up, put it in your mouth and breathe. If it still feels restricted, you've got a problem. If not, practice some more with the tube and remember that feeling when you're breathing normally.

[TexTuba]

Yet aother question in my constant search for knowladge..Should I have them taken out if I want to progress?

You would take them out for improved breathing?! I don't think that has anything to do with it, but I'm no doc. Why don't you just measure how much you have and then work to improve on it. I found this device that increases resistance for better inhalation and exhalation. I thought at first it was junk and some may say it is but all I know is that it worked for me. As far as surgery, I don't know whether to laugh at you for that silly remark or to laugh at you for being so hardcore as to consider having surgery to try and improve something like that!! Take it easy man..


Ralph

[Bill Troiano]

The cardboard tube is a good idea. Also, try going to Home Depot or a store like that where one can buy inground sprinkler supplies, and buy a 1 inch plastic hose coupling (less than $1.00) and breathe through that. I bought one for each of my private tuba students and I have them breathe through it. The 1 inch diameter closely approximates the size of the oral cavity and shows you what it's like to breathe with no restriction.
I would avoid tonsil surgery if at all possible. I had mine out when I was 21 and it was a miserable experience. The healing process took more than a month. I lost my sense of taste for 4 months - bummer!

[kontrabass]

There's nothing wrong with you. You are quite capable of filling that horn, or any other horn.
Just because you can't do it YET doesn't mean you won't be able to do it EVER. It's something that takes time and practice - so be patient with yourself. It's not going to happen overnight and you DEFINITELY don't want to be hacking up your body in an attempt to fix the 'problem'.

Specifically, you're going to learn over the next few years that you have been 'holding on' to muscles that will eventually need to relax. When you figure out how to relax these muscles, you'll be amazed at how much air you're able to move. I'm no medical expert but I've never heard of tonsils impeding breathing. What I HAVE heard of is tension in the chest and throat causing the air passageway to constrict. If you're thinking too hard about 'TAKING A HUGE BREATH!!!!' then you might be tensing your chest and throat, which restricts the airflow, giving you the opposite effect. Kinda zen huh? Ask your teacher about it, he'll have a better idea of what you have to do.


The makers of so-called 'weight-loss pills' could probably make a killing selling 'embouchure realignment pills' or 'air-capacity booster pills' to students. But there's no substitute for hard work and patience.

[TubaRay]

I'm not going to laugh at TubaChris. I am quite impressed that he would be willing to have his tonsils removed in order to breathe better. I'm pretty hard core about playing my best, and I wouldn't be willing to go that far. This may be the first time I have said something positive about TubaChris. Oh no! I'd better go see a shrink. Something must be wrong with me.

[MaryAnn]

Well, Chris, if I can play tuba You can play tuba.

If there is any way you can take Sam Pilafian's breathing class somewhere, somehow, do it. You will find air you did not know you had.

I suspect you are trying to breathe in too fast, actually. Try taking an entire measure to breathe in...fill your lungs, feel like you're filling your abdomen, and you'll notice that the bottom of your rib cage will expand sideways. When you're "full" .... stop and start taking additional "sips" of air. Take as many "sips" as you can, and then a couple more. You might find you have more capacity than you think you do. (extracted from Sam's class.) The more sound you make when inhaling, the more likely it is you are tightening your throat and restricting your airway. See how silently you can take in air....and you will be on the right track.

And do not, not, NOT, have your tonsils out for this reason (not that your parents or doctor would let you, anyway.) They are needed for your immune system to function......!! And as you get older you'll probably find there are other things you have to have out anyway, and that will be plenty to deal with at the time.

MA, 102# and 5'3" and challenging you to a blatting contest

[crbarnes]

In spite of Bloke's warnings, the Breathing Gymn is a good place to start. Any kind of deep breathing exercize will help. Repiratory therapists have also developed a series of breathing exercises that would help.
I went to a class run by Chris Olka and he talked of imagining a rope attached to your belly button and running at a 4 degree angle to a floor mounted pulley in front of you (don't try this for real; sounds painful ). As you take a breath, imagine someone pulling that rope via the pulley. It help you relax and breath deeply and fully. Don't worry if your belly goes out; where else are all those internal organs going to go when you expand your lungs?
Wind Song Press has several devices used by Arnold Jacobs to help. Things like rebreathing bags, etc. They also have a device that can give you a pretty good idea of your lung capacity.
Song and Wind by Arnold Jacobs has some good ideas. There are some articles on breathing available if you do a search on Tubenet. Skip Gray wrote an excellent article that you can download.
Relaxation is a key. Any muscle tension will inhibit your total capacity. Try taking as big a breath as you can while holding your arms straight above your head. When you then lower them, you will notice your lungs feel much fuller than normal.
Hope some of this helps.

BTW, do you exercize aerobically on a regular basis? Big help, that. Tuba playing is an aerobic activity and any other aerobic development you do will help you improve in this area.

[Charlie Goodman]

Chris, as someone your age, I'm pretty sure you aren't at the level where you need to start cutting out parts of your body to play. I know I wouldn't. I just need practice. If anything, just work on the other aspects of your playing that need woodsheddin'. You can keep trying with the air, and maybe later consider getting something like that done. It's one thing if a player that has gotten to the top of his game wants an operation to take him up past his competetition, but for someone at our level, I think we just need to work more and look less for shortcuts.

[brianf]

Different strokes for different folks but-

This is a rough crowd out there, they are also the last bunch of people I would want to ask for any medical advice. This is between you and your physician!!!

Reminds me of a trumpet teacher who heard Maynard. Seems Maynard had a gap between his two front teeth and this teacher thought that was what gave him the range. He sent a few students to a dentist to get a gap in the front teeth. Seems the next time Maynard passed through town, he had seen a dentist and had the gap closed. Poor students going around with a gap between their teeth.

[punk_tuba]

toilet-paper roll (when empty)


best way to realize my highest potential lung capacity

[tubeast]

Hey Chris,
surgery should always be done for medical reasons. You can be pretty damn sure your body has evolved close to perfection within the past 2 million years.
Many have posted this already, but I´ll try to give some explanation, too.

A lung full of air is a lung full of air, no matter if you exhale it through an injection needle, a straw, a garden hose or an ocean-liner´s exhaust pipe.
You just need more pressure to squeeze the same amount of air (again, volume per second) through a small opening than through a large one.
If you assume air to be a fluid of constant density and viscosity, (with a gas tis is a generalization, ´cause both both values depend on the pressure), that pressure is proportional to (1/d)³ , "d" being the diameter of a hose.
That means: decrease your throat to half it´s diameter, and you´ll need EIGHT TIMES the pressure you build up right now to empty your lungs at a given time.
Now, before you go out and have your throat inflated to three inches in diameter so you can move more air per second, look at your mouthpiece and your horn. Their bores are MUCH smaller than your throat, thus having an overwhelming effect on the pressure needed to play (1/d³, remember?).
So as long as it takes less time exhaling through your opened mouth than it takes exhaling through your mouthpiece, don´t worry about your throat size.
It will be much more efficient to concentrate on making use of as much of your lung capacity as possible.

[Joe Baker]

If I understand correctly, the perceived problem is on inhalation, not exhalation. Our young friend plays okay with the air he gets, but can't get enough in, or can't get it quickly enough.

It MIGHT POSSIBLY (though not 'probably') be that your tonsils are interfering with proper inhalation. My guess, though, is that if you're having problems breathing for tuba because of tonsils, you're having a lot of other problems due to them. My daughters both had difficulty breathing while exercising because of abnormally large tonsils. My youngest snored deafeningly at the age of three because of her tonsils, and seemed to be suffering from sleep apnea. My older daughter seemed to be sick constantly (sore throats and ear infections). They both had their tonsils removed, and have been much healthier with no ill effects (same as their Dad).

If you really think this is a problem, consult your doctor. But if you're not having other problems due to enlarged tonsils, don't even think about surgery until you've exhausted EVERY other method of improving airflow.

My own personal favorite explanation of proper breathing technique, btw, is this: yawn (without stretching). Do it several times, paying attention to the movement of the abdomen, the chest, and the shoulders. Notice that the lower abdoment fills first, then the chest. The shoulders move very little. Now do it again, and feel the openness of the throat and the back of your throat. This is the body's way of bringing in the maximum amount of air (yawning is, among other things, a response to low blood oxygen/high CO2). Learn to emulate those motions and you will likely make a significant step forward.
_______________________________
Joe Baker, whose breathing is still a weak spot, but better since learning the 'yawn' trick and losing 50 pounds.

[adam0408]

My own personal favorite explanation of proper breathing technique, btw, is this: yawn (without stretching). Do it several times, paying attention to the movement of the abdomen, the chest, and the shoulders. Notice that the lower abdoment fills first, then the chest. The shoulders move very little. Now do it again, and feel the openness of the throat and the back of your throat. This is the body's way of bringing in the maximum amount of air (yawning is, among other things, a response to low blood oxygen/high CO2). Learn to emulate those motions and you will likely make a significant step forward.
_______________________________
Joe Baker, whose breathing is still a weak spot, but better since learning the 'yawn' trick and losing 50 pounds.

That is probably the best breathing advice I have EVER heard. Many teachers (screw it, all teachers that know what they are talking about) paraphrase that very statement and in so doing make it very unclear. Thanks Joe, you just made my day.

Joel Adams, whose breathing has never been a big problem because he had good instruction early.