What's the best 4/4 BBb PISTON tuba under $10K?

Ltrain · Post by **Ltrain** » Mon Jun 11, 2018 1:55 pm

Asking for a friend

I know some of these options "list" for more than $10K but I always know how to get a deal... and there's always the used market

Please list your "others" and explanations below.

bigboymusic · Post by **bigboymusic** » Mon Jun 11, 2018 2:03 pm

I'm pretty sure you can still get a piston Fafner for 9K. That is a hell of a horn..... On your list, I think the 1291 wins

tubadoctor · Post by **tubadoctor** » Mon Jun 11, 2018 7:25 pm

If you ever come across any, the predecessors of the 2341 are amazing horns. The one piece bell horns. Mine is from the late '20s, and a buddy of mine has two from the 30's... I haven't played many modern horns that come close to any of them.

Art Hovey · Post by **Art Hovey** » Mon Jun 11, 2018 11:24 pm

I'd vote for the Wessex. The Big Mouth Brass is also good.

Ltrain · Post by **Ltrain** » Tue Jun 12, 2018 10:01 am

This is pretty cool. I’m only interested in pistons, so ignoring the rotary outliers... I’m enjoying the results.

If possible I would like to know:

1. Who voted for the 33-S and why. I’ve heard literally no owner feedback about this horn... and nothing good from the non-owners.
2. More about the Viverna. Opposite of the Kanstul, I’ve heard good things but haven’t seen any owner reviews. But I like that this is Chuck Nickels creation and I enjoy working with Jonathan... so I’m thinking this one has some high-value potential.

TheTuba · Post by **TheTuba** » Wed Jun 13, 2018 9:51 am

Personally, I will wait until Wessex tubas win a major audition. Then that's when I will buy them, as obviously major judges like the sound the player brings out.

Steve Marcus · Post by **Steve Marcus** » Wed Jun 13, 2018 10:09 am

ren wrote:Wessex has a 6/4 and a 4/4 piston. The Viverna is under 4K! Under 4K and under 10K are pretty significantly different. The wessex 6/4 Bflat (which if I WERE in a DC military band I would want), is under 7K.

The Wessex 6/4 BBb “Grand” was originally marketed as a 5-valve hydraulically built instrument. But now, as a 4-valve instument (otherwise the same tuba as the one reviewed by Chris Olka in YouTube “T&E #4”), it will sell much closer to the $5K range. There have already been preorders placed for this model (TB692 “Grand”). One of the reasons for the change is to diffentiate the “Grand” from another new 6/4 BBb that is coming down the pike soon...

At the Association of Concert Bands convention in Buffalo, at NABBA, and at the NWRTEC, a prototype of the “Prokofiev” 6/4 BBb with hand-hammered bell was shown. Many tubists had an opportunity to try it. Other than the ergonomics (which are being improved by repositioning the leadpipe), there were so many remarks of praise of this tuba. Priced near $10K, there are already at least two pre-orders placed (one by a very well-known tubist). Here is a short video of Gene Pokorny testing the “Prokofiev” with Charlie Vernon playing a new Wessex bass trombone model:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=oZqw2hAfsqE

InTuneBb · Post by **InTuneBb** » Wed Jun 13, 2018 10:17 am

Ltrain wrote:What’s the best 4/4 BBb PISTON tuba under $10K?

Ltrain wrote:4/4

bort · Post by **bort** » Wed Jun 13, 2018 10:28 am

I like the Miraphone 1291. Comfortable, easy to play, and a big sound. Very easy to play. Oh yeah, and it's easy to play.

Voisi1ev · Post by **Voisi1ev** » Wed Jun 13, 2018 11:52 am

I feel like these are all very different horns. Like a 1291 is probably larger than the rest.

PlayTheTuba · Post by **PlayTheTuba** » Wed Jun 13, 2018 12:17 pm

Although in your list the 1291 is probably the best overall. My personally favorite tuba is the Kanstul 33t the top action version of the 33s. My second favorite overall tubas would be a a toss of the Miraphone 1291, Miraphone 289 same tuba as the 1291/191 but with slanted rotary valves, the B&S gr51, or the B&S gr55 (I think this is the same as the 51 but bigger? not entirely sure). Oh I do also REALLY like the old style and the modern style Kings 2341's as well as the 1241's. Also I find the Eastman 534 and the King 2341 to be same. If you are buying new I would say go with the Eastman, feels like it has slightly better valves and build quality. Although sadly the last time I saw a 33t or s was 2010? Army band conference, I never got a chance to toot on another since

Best of luck to your friend!

Short story:
Best overall tuba on your list: Miraphone 1291
If you want a more nimble tuba go with the King/Eastman
If you want to be even more nimble then go with the Kanstul

Here is a link if haven't seen this thread. Talking about the Miraphone 1291 and the Kanstul 33s in more detail.
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=86135" target="_blank" target="_blank" target="_blank" target="_blank" target="_blank

I also find that the 33t and s to play similarly enough to each other to check out this review about the 33t, if detailed reviews for the 33s don't exist.
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=40040" target="_blank" target="_blank" target="_blank" target="_blank" target="_blank

EDIT: As pointed out I did some digging and it turns the 1291/191 and 289 BBb's may not be the same tubas with different valve sections. I perhaps thought the since they both share the same bell diameter, similar bore size through the valves, and the small curl? bow? (not sure what you call that) after the main tuning slide was the same. So disregard the part that I wrote saying that the 1291/191 and 289 are the same. I will now make a mental note so I don't spread misinformation in the future.

PlayTheTuba · Post by **PlayTheTuba** » Wed Jun 13, 2018 12:53 pm

Oh another tuba to add to the "Other" category if one can be found for under $10k is the Yamaha 632 Neo BBb. I have never played one nor have I ever seen to try one

but from what I have been reading it seems to be the best... well tuba so far. Although I am not sure if the Neo is a 4/4 or a 4.5/4 tuba. I do consider the Miraphone 1291 and family to be 4.5/4 tubas, if based only on the title of your post.

AndyCat · Post by **AndyCat** » Wed Jun 13, 2018 1:17 pm

I would say the Yamaha Neo has to be up there, as well as any (cheaper) 2nd hand Imperial or New Standard 3+1.

GC · Post by GC » Wed Jun 13, 2018 2:36 pm

PlayTheTuba wrote: . . . Miraphone 289 same tuba as the 1291/191 but with slanted rotary valves . . .

Not really. The 1291 is a compact wrapped body style. The 289 is a very tall horn, and the bugle is the basis for the 4/4 Hagen.

Steve Marcus · Post by **Steve Marcus** » Wed Jun 13, 2018 9:17 pm

As an employee of the company that builds one of the options listed, I recused myself from the poll.

TheTuba · Post by **TheTuba** » Wed Jun 13, 2018 10:51 pm

ren wrote:Theres a question missing in this topic....

What does "best" even mean? None of these horns will win anyone a job in the US. Are we saying "best" like best student horn? Best intonation? Im sure these horns do not all sound the same.
Construction? Ergonomics? Weight? Are these horns on the shelf in a retail outlet? How long will I have to wait to get one? If I decided it was "best" for some reason. Warranty?

Im missing the differentiation and assuming all voters have played all these horns.

I think that the Miraphone or King would win jobs.
If your talking about major orchestral auditions than they might.
All in all the horns up there are solid, so maybe his friend is talking about best bang for buck?

Carnival of Venice · Post by **Carnival of Venice** » Wed Jun 13, 2018 10:54 pm

Not to be rude;

Anytime I see the name “ren” and “TheTuba” involved with a thread, I know it HAS to be good...

TheTuba · Post by **TheTuba** » Wed Jun 13, 2018 11:02 pm

Carnival of Venice wrote:Not to be rude;

Anytime I see the name “ren” and “TheTuba” involved with a thread, I know it HAS to be good...

lol

Ken Crawford · Post by **Ken Crawford** » Wed Jun 13, 2018 11:45 pm

TheTuba wrote:I think that the Miraphone or King would win jobs.
If your talking about major orchestral auditions than they might.
All in all the horns up there are solid, so maybe his friend is talking about best bang for buck?

Oh yeah definitely. The King 2341 is winning all the auditions these days. I hear that Gene Pokorny is switching to it.

bort · Post by **bort** » Wed Jun 13, 2018 11:46 pm

The B&S 3301 is also a very fine tuba.

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