So, why is this?

[Donn]

Good heavens, is Ackroyd guzzling Old Overcoat there?

There is a normal "fixed do" system, standard usage in France, Spain, Italy etc., that indeed uses those same old syllables and appends an accidental mark. G is "Sol". Then there's a lot of weird stuff. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solfeggio (interesting mixup on that URL - the page is really at "Solfège", an unusual and possibly standard-violating use of a character value outside classic 7 bit ASCII. But the forum software can't see that as a URL, so here it's Solfeggio for a redirect.)

[KKORO]

Not many use fixed Solfeggio. If you do, B natural is "ti." In fixed doh, #'s have "i" on the end of an ascending passage and (with the exception of Db) an "e" on the end of the syllable. So, Doh, Di, Re, Ri, Mi, Fa, Fi, So, Si, La, Li, Ti, Doh is an ascending chromatic scale. A descending scale would be Doh, Ti(De), Te,La, Le, So, Fi(Se), Fa, Mi, Me, Re, Ra(Di), Doh.

KKORO

Wow, when did this come about? When I was taught fixed-do (back when pterodactyls roamed the skies) the accidentals didn't change the name of the note, and B natural was definitely si....

B natural may sound like "si" but it's actually spelled "ti" and sounds like the "zz" in pizza. (Lordy, Lordy, we'll probably get on a ZZ Top kick now)

KKORO

[roweenie]

Not many use fixed Solfeggio. If you do, B natural is "ti." In fixed doh, #'s have "i" on the end of an ascending passage and (with the exception of Db) an "e" on the end of the syllable. So, Doh, Di, Re, Ri, Mi, Fa, Fi, So, Si, La, Li, Ti, Doh is an ascending chromatic scale. A descending scale would be Doh, Ti(De), Te,La, Le, So, Fi(Se), Fa, Mi, Me, Re, Ra(Di), Doh.

KKORO

Wow, when did this come about? When I was taught fixed-do (back when pterodactyls roamed the skies) the accidentals didn't change the name of the note, and B natural was definitely si....

B natural may sound like "si" but it's actually spelled "ti" and sounds like the "zz" in pizza. (Lordy, Lordy, we'll probably get on a ZZ Top kick now)

KKORO

I guess you're never too old to learn something new (?)

Well, that may or not be correct now, but back in the day, when I was a student at Manhattan School of Music, we were taught fixed-do solfeggio, and B natural was spelled (and pronounced), si. I guess they must have been wrong, too.

[iiipopes]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solfege" target="_blank

Yes, just like my elementary school teachers would not let us reference the "World Book" as an authoritative source when writing term papers, I understand Wiki is the cyberspace version of World Book.

But the reason I posted the wiki link is because it does have a good list of references and links to authoritative sources at the bottom, and does give an overview of the movable and fixed systems, and points of history as a take-off to further research.

[iiipopes]

I don't trust wikipedia...I only trust facebook.

My point exactly in pointing out the references at the bottom of the page.

[humBell]

So und of music... and Close Encounters of the 3rd Kind.

That is my solfeg experience.

---

Lyrics to the Close Encounters theme someone told me are:

"Don't eat yellow snow!"

---

But as to the original topic question.

It is a good idea to think before you speak, but sometimes it behooves one in person to start talking before they finish thinking. Consequently, there are a bunch of place holder syllables often used to stall. So is a good one. If you wish to vary it up, you can also use well... um... Gee... Peeerhaps... but... and... i think i am running out of common ones, but anything can be pressed into service. This artifact of speach is carried over to writing even if the time constraints are no longer an issue. It might still have some form of artistic merit?

That help?

[Donn]

Well, that may or not be correct now, but back in the day, when I was a student at Manhattan School of Music, we were taught fixed-do solfeggio, and B natural was spelled (and pronounced), si. I guess they must have been wrong, too.

No, that's the "traditional" version, which is the only one I've ever seen, but there are others. Gbb would be Sibb, in that system. One of the alternatives, listed as "Sotorrio", splits the difference and makes it "Tsi" - and Gbb is "La" (shocking, I know!)

There are two of those fixed-do variants that use "so". One of them (Shearer) for G, the other (Siler) for Gb. But those are hopelessly obscure systems. Anything you're likely to encounter will use "Sol". The impression that there's a "So" apparently comes from pronouncing it only before "La".

[windshieldbug]

After I bounced off that wall, my Porsche Bbbbb!

[MaryAnn]

Good heavens, is Ackroyd guzzling Old Overcoat there?

There is a normal "fixed do" system, standard usage in France, Spain, Italy etc., that indeed uses those same old syllables and appends an accidental mark. G is "Sol". Then there's a lot of weird stuff. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solfeggio (interesting mixup on that URL - the page is really at "Solfège", an unusual and possibly standard-violating use of a character value outside classic 7 bit ASCII. But the forum software can't see that as a URL, so here it's Solfeggio for a redirect.)

Well, that explains finally something from back when I was studying violin with Daniel Guilet. He offered what he clearly felt was a challenge to sing something in front of me in solfege.....and knowing the do re mi etc I just sang it using those names. He looked surprised and entirely shut up about it forever. I was never sure what was surprising but didn't really care.

[BrassedOn]

Explanations abound. Languages change over time. Even if unnecessary, "so" must be serving some function to the speaker and listener. I think the most common use is to signal, I have started speaking, and I'm going to start with some background info, and it may take some time. Now (also unnecessary), in terms of meaning, it would make sense to me to start with "because". "Because Aunt Sadie ate the bad sushi, and because her dog has to stay in the kennel when she travels..."

About halfway, you realize this would all be solved my an intermediate "I told ya that to tell ya this....".

BTW, Aunt Sadie is fine.

https://www.npr.org/2015/09/03/43273285 ... ce-with-so" target="_blank

[Donn]

Ah, I didn't realize complaining about "so, ..." was "a thing." At NPR anyway.

Reminds me, for no particular reason, of a listener comment I heard some years back, on the topic of "an" used before words starting with H. "An historic" being the one that NPR usage was particularly strong on. I don't really remember the content - I suppose there were some examples of words starting with H that never rate an "an". What I remember is that he signed off as ...

-- Just an Hick

[MaryAnn]

Well, silly boy, they use "an" when they use a silent H. As in An Istoric whatever. An erb. Or A Herb if you pronounce the H, or A Historic if pronouncing the H. Anybody who says An Historic has got a double whatever going on. I guess this is a Pronunciation Police type of thing.

[Donn]

Right, and - so - the police having been themselves busted, they abandoned that game and took off after "So, ..."