The Tuba Exchange

[MikeMason]

I try to adopt my favorite sales trainer's advice " You can have everything you want in life if you just help enough other people get what they want."-Zig Ziglar. Works for me.I don't recommend being a jerk to your customers either....

[mTaUrBkA]

Are there anyother stores liek the tuba exchange, or at least music stores that have more tubas than most stores?

[poomshanka]

Dave,

Your buddy might say, "You get what you pay for."

Doc

Tony wanted $9600 for a silver PCM, Vince sold his for $8K. The leopard showed his spots after the horn arrived damaged, having no clue he was dealing with a tiger.

With Vince's guidance, FedEx set the damage amount at $2600. He actually wanted FedEx to total the horn, issue a credit for $8K, then we suspect sell it back to him on salvage. All of this info was gleaned behind the scenes by my buddy from a FedEx claims adjustor who was on the receiving end of one too many of Vince's screaming bloody murder phone tirades.

After finding out the true scoop, my buddy then spoke to Vince, who proceeded to tell him that he had yet to speak to or hear from anyone at FedEx, and didn't know what dollar figure they were going to arrive upon. Truth was that FedEx had sent him a check for $2600 three days earlier, a fact that Vince was well aware of, as they had told him that exact thing at the time they sent it. Vince then issued a pick slip to have the horn returned immediately, ostensibly to "handle the repair in-house". I think we can all guess where that one was going.

My buddy put a stop payment on the credit card charge, and re-authorized Vince to submit an adjusted debit of $5400. Vince didn't get to sell the horn twice and double-end the deal, but he did get what he originally agreed to sell it for - $5400 from his customer, $2600 from FedEx.

It cost around $150 for Robb Stewart to repair the damage so well you can't even tell where it was hit.

Afterwards, my buddy and I headed up to see Tony about an Alex I was thinking of buying, and brought his PCM along for comparison. We both felt it played better than either of the two Tony had for sale.

A whole lot of time going back-n-forth with Vince and FedEx, $5550 net for a great PCM, and a great story to boot about manhandling Vince. Actually, I think my buddy would say he got a lot more than what he paid for. Doesn't mean Vince wasn't a giant speedbump in the whole process, but he did end up on someone's lunch plate at the end of the day...



...Dave

[Lew]

Are there anyother stores liek the tuba exchange, or at least music stores that have more tubas than most stores?

I know of 4 other stores in the United States that keep a good number of tubas in stock, Dillon Music, Baltimore Brass, The Woodwind and the Brasswind, and Low Brass works. I think that the first 3 generally have larger inventories. I have purchased tubas from the first 2 and have nothing but good experiences with them. Oberloh Music and Taylor Music (1800usaband) also usually have a number of tubas in stock.

[scottw]

Are there anyother stores liek the tuba exchange, or at least music stores that have more tubas than most stores?

Yes! Also much closer to N.H.--Dillon's in North Jersey. If you can't find your tuba there you are impossible to please! You wouldn't belive how many and of such great quality. Matt Walters is the tuba specialist/repairman and he is an ace.

[Paul S]

Are there anyother stores liek the tuba exchange, or at least music stores that have more tubas than most stores?

I know of 4 other stores in the United States that keep a good number of tubas in stock, Dillon Music, Baltimore Brass, The Woodwind and the Brasswind, and Low Brass works. I think that the first 3 generally have larger inventories. I have purchased tubas from the first 2 and have nothing but good experiences with them. Oberloh Music and Taylor Music (1800usaband) also usually have a number of tubas in stock.

The four mentioned above are super places to visit but please add Custom Music in Northern Detroit to this list.
http://www.custommusiccorp.com/

It would be worthwhile to visit both Custom and Woodwind & Brasswind on a Midwest tuba trip as they are "reasonably" close and would offer you a tremendous amount of tubas to try out. I was treated exceptionally well at Custom when I bought my B&S Perantucci PT-606.

While I was shopping for a new CC last year, I had looked at quite a few brands and models and had actually pretty much decided on a different horn and seller before I made one last trip to see what Custom had. I felt no pressure, was given fast access to bunches of different horns I wanted to try, and in the end received a good price once I found the "one" I had really been looking for.

Good Luck!

[MartyNeilan]

Lee Stofer outside of Atlanta often has a ton of used horns in his shop (most not listed in his website) as well as some new ones lying around.

[mTaUrBkA]

do any of these stores have a substantial amount of tuba accessories?

[Leland]

I once had a kite seller tell me that, of the two-line stunt kites he had, I was already beyond what he could offer.

It went like this -- I asked what he had, and he showed them to me. He then asked me what I was flying already, I told him, and he truthfully responded by saying that the stunt kites he had weren't as advanced & capable as the ones I owned.

I'm not seeing any stories like that in this thread. Casual conference friendliness is one thing, but the true character comes out when unusual situations arise.

(btw -- I ended up buying a fighter kite instead, and without any prompting from the kite guy)

[zeman23]

I once had a kite seller tell me that, of the two-line stunt kites he had, I was already beyond what he could offer.

It went like this -- I asked what he had, and he showed them to me. He then asked me what I was flying already, I told him, and he truthfully responded by saying that the stunt kites he had weren't as advanced & capable as the ones I owned.

I'm not seeing any stories like that in this thread. Casual conference friendliness is one thing, but the true character comes out when unusual situations arise.

(btw -- I ended up buying a fighter kite instead, and without any prompting from the kite guy)

When I was shopping for a tuba last year, I went to see Tony Clements. I told him what my musical experience was, and that I was using a yamaha ybb641 that belonged to a local community college. The very first thing he said to me was "why do you need to buy a tuba? what's wrong with what you're using for FREE?" For me, that set the stage for the whole interaction. I was given good advice, and plenty of time to sit and play anything he had in stock. Tony didn't try to push ANY horn on me. 3 hours later i walked out with a Miraphone 1291, and couldn't be happier.

-Zack Zeman

[Rick Denney]

I've bought a lot of things in my life, and had my share of good experiences and bad experiences.

Let me sum up the bad experiences: I had not done my research beforehand and was not an informed buyer.

Being an informed buyer is more than knowing the collective opinion on Tubenet. Tubenet is like most groups--any ten people here will have 16 opinions, 22 of which are not appropriate to the situation at hand. Being an informed buyer means knowing what sort of product will work, knowing how to test that product to make sure it works, and knowing its fair price. I'll buy a used car from a used-car salesman ANY DAY OF THE WEEK without concern, but I walk onto the lot informed.

My three elements of being informed are not always available to every potential buyer. I don't suspect there are many high-school kids who really have a basis for selecting a tuba, other than hearsay opinion. If I can't bring my own expertise to a transaction, I will rent it. I DO NOT expect a seller to make my decision for me. There are sellers who will give good advice even when it means the loss of a sale or the lowering of profit, but they are in conflict with their books (and often their employers) when they do so. It's a conflict of interest and I don't expect it. I bring my own expertise with me, even if I have to borrow or rent it.

Most salespeople have to learn how to cover their feelings about most buyers, especially buyers of things that require skill to use effectively. Most of them endure endless thrashings of the Ride of the Valkyries from kids who think blastissimo is a complimentary adjective. How can they give advice? "Listen, kid, you are a dreadful tuba player, and you really ought to learn how to play the damn thing before spending your parents' money. And you parents, you are trying to buy your kid's love with a hunk of brass, and trying to nickel-and-dime even that transaction without knowing a damn thing. Sheesh! You'd be just as well off with a trash can and a mouthpiece." If that described tuba salespeople, I for one might never have been allowed to buy a tuba, and especially not the great tubas that I could afford at the time but still cannot play worth a darn.

The Tuba Exchange is a place where they will accept money in return for a tuba. If the buyer thinks the tuba is worth the money being paid, the deal will happen. Custom music and many other stores are just the same. They have instruments that they push because their profit margins are higher, perhaps, but the people doing the buying are still the ones making the decision.

There are dealers who might offer advice to uninformed buyers that undermine their commercial position, and those buyers are the recipients of extreme generosity for which they should be grateful. But they don't deserve it, and the dealers are not obligated to provide it. Of the people I know in business as a whole, I would say that tuba buyers enjoy a much higher chance of being saved from themselves by a selfless dealer than is generally the case. But it would be better if they weren't so uninformed.

Finally, I think we should all stop guessing about dealers and reporting what we think we know of their reputation as if it is fact. This includes unbridled praise as well as unqualified condemnation. I have had good dealings with nearly all of the tuba sellers for one thing or another. They all have strengths and weaknesses, and depending on what I want and what they have, I might call any of them. But the result will ultimately be my responsibility in every case.

Rick "caveat emptor" Denney

[poomshanka]

Many years ago I quit having any interest whatsoever in the reputation or attitude of a seller of anything I became interested in buying, and have nearly totally based my major purchasing decisions on the object itself, its condition, and its cost - with nearly zero interest in anything (other than legal ownership status) of the seller.

bloke "who thinks he's agreeing with Rick Denney"

In theory, and for the most part reality, I agree with this philosophy. Where it might start to get a little less clear-cut is when something else is involved besides you handing them money, and them handing you - say, for instance - a tuba. If your ultimate satisfaction with the product and the transaction hinges in some way on a "service after the sale" issue, you might still be in for a crate full of ***-pain.

Sad, but true...

...Dave

[poomshanka]

I guess my buddy just found the one chink in the transactional armor - make sure to pack the hell out of the horn before putting it on a truck. All Vince's three-legged, one-winged, lice-ridden chickens came home to roost in the aftermath of that f-up. I'm sure my buddy could've died happy and fulfilled if he'd never had to speak with Vince beyond agreeing to a price and giving a credit card number.

Buying and selling tubas *shouldn't* be that complicated, right?? Of course, if you know a thing or two about rolling out the dents, that sure doesn't hurt!



...Dave