Top-loading Cronkhite gig bag alternatives

[bort]

**Edit** Changed the title of this thread to reflect the change in discussion.

[bisontuba]

Terrific!

[windshieldbug]

[Renodoc]

Yep- saw this while shopping for a new bag yesterday and donated some $$

[Rick Denney]

I have a bag for my Eastman on order with them, and hadn't heard a thing in the five weeks since I ordered it on their website. But it's not like I have anywhere to go with the tuba anyway.

Rick "desensitized by the 8 months it took to get a Gotz Supersac for my Hirsbrunner" Denney

[bort]

I have a bag for my Eastman on order with them, and hadn't heard a thing in the five weeks since I ordered it on their website. But it's not like I have anywhere to go with the tuba anyway.

Rick "desensitized by the 8 months it took to get a Gotz Supersac for my Hirsbrunner" Denney

Dang... the Gotz that I ordered a few years ago took about 4 weeks.

I also have a bag on order with Cronkhite, and also have zero need for it ATM.

[Rick Denney]

Just corresponded with Steve at Torpedo. He said he's having a hard time getting tuba bags done because they are too big to send home and don't meet the requirements for "essential"--all of which is reasonable. This will be a blow to him and he's trying to hang on to his staff by making masks, as well as smaller cases.

Rick "not in any hurry, of course" Denney

[Renodoc]

That's good to know. I ended up ordering a bag Monday but like you, I ain't going anywhere soon. Maybe it'll just be nice for him to have some projects ready to go when this is all over

[bort]

Posting an update here, because the other Cronkhite thread got deleted...

I decided to bail on Cronkhite, and I cancelled my order. There are other gig bag options out there, which are just as good and don't require waiting 6, 8, 12, ??? months (pandemic or not).

[Rick Denney]

Posting an update here, because the other Cronkhite thread got deleted...

I decided to bail on Cronkhite, and I cancelled my order. There are other gig bag options out there, which are just as good and don't require waiting 6, 8, 12, ??? months (pandemic or not).

Last year, I bought a triple-padded side-load Supersac from Götz for my Hirsbrunner, on Peter Hirsbrunner's recommendation. My first contact with them was in March, and it was nearly October when I received the bag. The promised production time started out as 2-3 weeks. Getting it done require considerable intercession from Bob Tucci's staff.

But the bag is superb--the only gig bag I've ever seen that is as good, and maybe better, than a Cronkhite. But I've owned bags from most of the well-known suppliers, and inspected more. "Just as good" may mean it fulfills your requirements, which is fine. But it may not mean that it fulfills the same requirements as a Cronkhite.

Sometimes you just have to wait for the best stuff, if you want the best stuff.

Rick "quality, price, speed: pick one" Denney

[bort]

Thanks, Rick. I've owned a few Gotz bags, and I agree, they are excellent. Until recently, they were a no brainier for me, and the only choice for a top loading bag. As Joe mentioned, the new Superfine cases are another extremely nice option.

In 2015, I bought a triple padded Gotz from Bob Tucci for my rotary Willson. From order to receipt, I think it was maybe 4 to 6 weeks. Perhaps that was an anomaly, but it went quite smoothly, and the result was stunning. Not without a few flaws (shoulder straps offer zero comfort), but the build quality is top notch, and the fit and finish are as good as it gets.

I do think there is a huge difference between the standard double padding and the upgraded triple padding... I would only order triple! Also, I'm not so sure about longevity... my old PT7 had an old Gotz supersac ... Which was pretty well worn out. I have heard of other Gotz bags that start to fray or get holes from wear. Nothing lasts forever, but for 20 years old, the PT7 bag looked rough. By comparison, a 20 year old Reunion Blues leather bag that came with my Willson... That bag looked like it was just starting to hit it's stride at 20 years old.

Gotz bags are quite pretty to look at, and are quite svelte. I had this bag with my Rudy 4/4:



Here is the Gotz that I had with my Willson:


With all of this said, I probably owe a more formal and more detailed review of the Superfine bag that's currently in my closet (kids are sleeping, so no photos ATM). But in brief... It's not the correct size for my tuba (which I knew up front), so I can't speak much to "fit"... But build quality is excellent, and it looks and feels every bit like if Cronkhite made a top-loading bag. The cordura and zippers feel extremely strong, while not looking like it's some kind of industrial level product. And the padding is going to be very familiar to you Cronkhite owners. Tom and Adolfo know their stuff and know exactly what they are doing... Tom is a tuba player, so he's "one of us," and is making these tuba bags the best and most practical as possible. Just looks like a really well thought-out tuba gig bag.

Here are two photos of the Superfine top-loader.



Two excellent options.

[Rick Denney]

Sorry for the slow response.

Yes, the triple padding is worth what it costs.

Mine may have taken as long as it did because it was a custom pattern. They had the pattern, at least, which is more than Cronkhite had (even when Glen was still working).

As to wearing out, the construction looks to me nearly identical in the details to Cronkhite's construction methods. The material is very heavy guage Cordura nylon (which is what separates it from the polyester cheapies), and all the stress points are sewn through thick full-grain leather gussets. The zippers seem even heavier than those used by Cronkhite. I'm not sure what there is to wear out any different than with the Cronkhite bags.

My oldest Cronhite-made bag is a Reunion Blues, sized for a Miraphone but I used it with my B&S F tuba. I traded an Altieri bag for it to a guy who wanted a top loader (I have always preferred side loaders). That was in 1992, and it was well-used even then. So I can absolutely confirm the longevity of Cronkhite bags.

Removable shoulder straps is another option with Gotz, and I recommend it. You are right that the straps are the weakness. I bought a pair of backpack straps to replace them (the camouflage looks a bit strange on the black bag, but I don't care)--maybe $30 on ebay. They were used on military backpacks and have an overload release (presumably to prevent the enemy from dragging a soldier by the pack from behind), and I put chain links through those to prevent accidental release. But they are well-designed for comfort and adjustability, and cheap.

And I bought a Red Oxx "The Claw" for the one-shoulder strap, which is simply brilliant. The padding is molded onto that strap, and ultra-non-slip in addition to being apparently indestructable. The clips suggest that the 125-pound rating is not fictional. Also $30. [url]https://www.redoxx.com/claw-shoulder-strap-92008/p]/url] I carry the tuba over one shoulder only because that Red Oxx strap is so secure from slipping.

That said, there is nothing weak about the straps Gotz supplied, they simply aren't that comfortable.

Of course, shoulder straps on a Cronkhite are not replaceable without cutting rivets, and there is some advantage in that simplicity.

What I particularly like about the Gotz Supersac is that it is cut to minimize bulk, as you mention. Ray Grim came back from Germany back in the deeps of time with a wood case that oriented his Miraphone 186-CC bell and lead-pipe down and left-side outer branches up. It had a curved top that made the case much more compact than the typical wood case that has a bunch of extra space above the upper bow, next to the bell. The Gotz bag is cut that way, even though it is carried with the bell on the top. Your picture shows that, but it's more pronounced on my tall-bell Hirsbrunner kaiser. Also, the side-opening design means that one side unzips, rather than a clamshell zipper around the middle like Cronkhite and Protec. The zipper runs down the edge of the side panel, and around half of the bell. It's a good design that provides excellent access to the instrument.

Rick "wishing he had a need for gig bags right now" Denney

[bort]

Thanks Rick, that's great info! So your Gotz is a side loader? Can you post a few photos?

Here's the wear from the Gotz that came with my PT7. Little cuts and holes, and some wear and failure around the zipper at the cap. This tuba and bag were used professionally in Colombia and Venezuela, and we're heavily used. Perhaps a lesser gig bag would have failed far more rapidly, and this bag far exceeded expectations of longevity.

The tuba was 20 years old, so the case was probably the same age. Yes, at some point, even well made things do wear out... I just hadn't seen his kind of wear on a Cronkhite, and especially not on a leather Cronkhite of any age.



The Superfine tuba bag is also quite excellent, and the fact that it is available as a top loader in leather just makes my head spin... It's a luxury for sure, but would last as long as the tuba. Those damn Gotz bags are so slick though. Just like tubas though, we can't have them all, and need to pick one and not look back.

As I said before, these are two excellent options, and although we are talking a lot about Gotz here, the Superfine is really quite a beautiful case. The one I have here is made for a larger tuba, so that's why the fit doesn't look quite as svelte. I'm sure when made to measure, it'll fit like a glove.