PLEASE - A THREAD ON THE SCIENCE OF PLAYING.

[2ba4t]

I have just posted on

Re: The Mouthpiece Maze Post by 2ba4t » Wed Jan 06, 2021 4:30 am .

On this, a wonderful - science-knowledgeable - gentleman most kindly posted some comments to correct my muddled understanding of mouthpieces - and thus revealed his existence. He, and all physicists etc on tubenet, should be pleaded with generously to man a thread on 'the science of playing the tuba' to help us improve and avoid nonsense like that which I write from half-understanding. If you google, most papers out there are too complex and full of nasty equations or other posted explanations are too easy and generalised.

Please, please - wonderful team - consider this. Anyone else feel it is worth it? Even my poor comprehension on the physics of jazz screamers' altissmo gave me an extra octave at the top (- still working up -) and allowed me to build Frankentuba extras to cure the results of the intonation war between brass instruments and physics and improve on the comp system.

MISSION STATEMENT - We tuba players deserve to be freed from the sellers of snake oil and misunderstood but genuinely-believed advice.

Thank you for your kind consideration etc.

[macbil]

Steven Norsthworthy posted here a while ago on a similar topic . Have a look at his You Tube lecture on Mouthpiece and Buzzing .Very interesting indeed.Then go to Soundcloud and listen to him play. I rest my case.
He who knows and knows that he knows--- follow him!
We need to hear more from this man.

[macbil]

Steven Norsthworthy posted here a while ago on a similar topic . Have a look at his You Tube lecture on Mouthpiece and Buzzing .Very interesting indeed.Then go to Soundcloud and listen to him play. I rest my case.
He who knows and knows that he knows--- follow him!
We need to hear more from this man.

[2ba4t]

I listened carefully but it is too technical for me. He presumes too much technical knowledge for me.
e.g.
quarter wave Helmholtz resonator
time domain
frequency domain
pulses of air through it
impulse response of the system
cycles of ringing
FFT frequency response on a log .... .....
Acoustic impulse response impedance what are you impeding the amount of air you need a lot of power with very little air flow
20 DB – a factor of 10 in amplitude rejecting amplitude by a factor of ten –
Quarter wave impulse resonator frequency – it will try to pull or push you – away from that pitch - not allowing you to buzz – as opposed to free buzzing
Flat acoustic impedance
Atmospheric flat low

I think I heard that a mouthpiece will try to stop you from playing anything other than one particular note??!!

Help, please. I could find only explanations for primary school kids or those fluent in the techno-geek lingo.

[Erik_Sweden]

What he is saying is that on that mouthpiece which he do his measuring on, all tones buzzed in will be dampen except B and Bb. This means if you try to buzz let say a Eb you will need to work much harder to get same volume as if you buzz a Bb. Instead it is much better to "free buzz" (just lips, no mouthpoiece) because in a mouthpiece your are locked to one resonance peek (B and Bb in this case), but in free air, there is no peek.

[macbil]

I've been looking for his You Tube lesson where he has a MW F tuba (not sure which model) and talks about impedance on certain notes and pressure. I came across it on Tubenet but I can't find it . It was very interesting!
Anybody help?

[2ba4t]

I have now searched and found the whole thing was discussed only 18 months ago. I was as mystified then as now - which is scientific proof of my wisdom in not trying sciences. That which I am asking for is a layman's explanation of what is happening and why we should do certain things to accomplish the best outcome.
Erik's kind explanation seems to suggest that a mouthpiece can produce only one pitch and all others are working against physics.

on that mouthpiece which he does his measuring on, all tones buzzed in will be dampened except B and Bb. This means if you try to buzz let say an Eb you will need to work much harder to get the same volume as if you buzz a Bb. Instead, it is much better to "free buzz" (just lips, no mouthpiece) because in a mouthpiece your are locked to one resonance peek (B and Bb in this case), but in free air, there is no peek.

Do I understand that for a given length of tubing (e.g. closed position on the bone - BBb/Bb/F partials etc) this length will dictate the frequency at which your lips can buzz. The 'standing [set up] wave comes back and hits your lips at the frequency your length of tubing dictates. Obviously you can play [clearly] only the note in tune with that. This is because the length of that air column dictates that only the 'Bb-harmonics-sympathetic' energy wave can bounce 'to and fro' along the stationary air column as a [set up and repeating - i.e. standing] sound wave. Lengthen the slide and you have a new length and a whole new set of harmonics because that length dictates a different set of waves travelling back and activating the lips. So your lips have to be 'trying' to create exactly the right set of harmonics and one of them in particular.

Phew.

[peterbas]

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[zangerzzz]

Maybe an art and not a science.

[peterbas]

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