Doing mods on an old horn

[tubeast]

I´d suggest you get the horn to a repairperson and give them good money for good work. If the necessary amount of $$ exceeds what you´re willing to pay, trade in the horn or live with it.

Think of it this way:
1) Are you willing to put up with a horn that´ll look like an amateur fiddled with it?
(It WILL look like that. I´ve seen a tuba with a leadpipe WELDED to the bell. It had been taken to a mechanic PROFESSIONALLY doing dentwork on cars. Don´t know the English term).
2) If so, what do you think is the value of one hour of both yours and your Dad´s spare time ?
3) How long do you estimate will it take to get all parts / tools / material in place, and then do the work twice b/c you´ll probably mess up the first time (at least)?
4) By what percentage do you guess the repairperson will raise their fee when you eventually let them fix what you messed up, just to let you suffer for it ?

Take all these factors into account and see what you get.

By the way, I don´t know the shop you took that horn to, but from what you described I wouldn´t let them touch my instruments. They recommended to GLUE parts on the horn ??

[MartyNeilan]

into the local shop

Unless you happen to live in a rare handful of cities like NY, LA, Chicago, Atlanta, Baltimore, or Seattle (or even Memphis) , the "local shop" is about the worst place to take a tuba for anything other than a stuck mouthpiece. Do a little research on repair and customization, and you will find the same names and places popping up again and again - it is worth the extended drive or the shipping costs to not have your horn destroyed.

[Dan Schultz]

into the local shop

Unless you happen to live in a rare handful of cities like NY, LA, Chicago, Atlanta, Baltimore, or Seattle (or even Memphis) , the "local shop" is about the worst place to take a tuba for anything other than a stuck mouthpiece.

It's unfortunate that MOST repair shops tend to be 'parts replacers' and places to get a clarinet or sax repadded. MOST repair shops that deal with school instruments don't have a clue how to approach doing custom work to an instrument.... especially on a tuba. I do custom work on a daily basis but also tend to shy away from jobs where I detect that a customer wants 'the moon for a song'. That being said, there are a few cities out there besides the ones Marty mentioned where you can get work done at a reasonable price. If all else fails, there always FEDEX, USPS, UPS, and Greyhound to help you get a horn from point A to point B.

[Dan Schultz]

The valve guide that I mention screws into the valve, but the threads are ruined. It seems that a spot of glue would do the trick.
The tech seems to have a good reputation with the guys that I play with, and these are only simple jobs really.

Is it the threads on the guide or the hole in the piston that is bad? Just a new valve guide might fix the problem. If the threads are stripped out of the piston... I suppose a little epoxy (or glue) might work, but the best fix is to restore the threads. A 'quick fix' would be to add a little soft solder to the hole then re-drill and tap it. It'll make things a whole lot simpler if you have to change the valve guide later.

[Chuck(G)]

I'd probably cut a set of larger threads, screw a brass or nickel silver rod into the new threads, solder it in, then bore and thread for the new valve gude.

Alternatively, one could make a new guide with larger threads by simply finding the appropriately-sized brass panhead screw and filing the head to fit.

[Dan Schultz]

I'd probably cut a set of larger threads, screw a brass or nickel silver rod into the new threads, solder it in, then bore and thread for the new valve gude.

Alternatively, one could make a new guide with larger threads by simply finding the appropriately-sized brass panhead screw and filing the head to fit.

And both of these suggestions will probably last your life time.

I agree. These methods would be my preferrence over my 'quick fix' comment above. I just assumed the original poster would want the 'quick and dirty' fix.

[windshieldbug]

my horn plays very sharp and this would allow me to push my main slide in a bit... 13 and 23 play in tune fine but 123 E is sharp and 123 A is really sharp... I would also like to have my main tuning slide extended about 2"

Your horn was built to what was known as "high pitch".
see: Notes on Early 20th Century Pitch Standards
Everything needs to come out some. Guessing, without looking at the horn, the tuning slide CAN be made longer, if that's what you want.

[prototypedenNIS]

Bob, I've seen you go off on tangeant about doing custom work on instruments before and I'm going to have to say the same thing as I said before when you wanted to turn your amati into an Eb or F tuba.

For a horn that old, it's got to be worth something to do all that to. If you had an old professional Besson, very old Cerveny, Highams, or something along that line that has the potential to be a good horn but with this horn you are quite likely to end up with a horn that could at most be a great decoration.

but on what you want to do to it
1) this might work...
2) there have been several bits of good advice on this, I think filing the screw would be the quickest and simplest.
3) changing the valve configuration is extensive. The tech's who have been known to go all out and actually do conversions usually order in a new valve section. (see bottom of the link below)
http://www.oberloh.com/martintuba/martintuba.htm
4) This could be the easy part but still would be very time consuming.

[Daniel C. Oberloh]

Sounds like an interesting horn. I just finished fitting a complete set of new, made to order screw-in guides for an old French Besson trumpet (late 40s). I completely restored the instrument and the guides were the last part of the project to complete prior to final assembly. Replacing the guides is a job that can be done at a very reasonable cost. If the threds in the side of the piston are stripped (this I doubt but it has happened) simply retap in a slightly oversize thread and make some new guides. No glues or solder are needed. Its no big deal and can be done in about an hours time. You just need to know how to do it and have the right tools for the job. If the pistons threds have been badly damaged this can also be corrected with a little more effort and skill but it is still very doable.
All the other corrections and repairs mentioned are not that big a deal ether to any of the Techs with real skills at working on large brass. making a new mouthpipe and receiver, alterations to the master slide, cleaning, maybe even a valve rebuild is needed.
If your just looking for a cheap, quick fix go for it, you might luck out and have exactly what you want but if you are expecting a quality job that will last and contribute to the instruments playability and increase its monitary value, you are going to need to have the desired work performed by one of a handfull of vetran specialists that reside accross the country.


Pick a repair shop known for there ability to deliver what you want, make a phone call and get it done right! you will be glad you did.

Daniel C. Oberloh
Oberloh Woodwind and Brass Works
www.oberloh.com

[Art Hovey]

Lengthening the tuning slide as you described is not difficult, but it can be disappointing. I did that with an old Salvation Army euphonium and the result was a horn with a very flat middle F. On my Besson "prototype" euphonium just pulling the main slide out enough to get it down to 440 over most of the range causes the low Bb to go very flat. But if you don't like the result on your horn you can always put the original tubing back. The next step would be to find a longer leadpipe.
As for the epoxied valve guides, it won't last. Use the advice above.