the schiller American Heritage 6 Valve Rotary F Tuba

[Diegoo]

HI, I am very happy to be in this forum
I want to buy the SCHILLER F tuba because it is very economical,
Someone has played it?
what person can talk about this?
is tuned? the keys work well?
Thanks a lot.

[bububassboner]

Played them, more than one of them. Valves kinda sucked. Slides were really rough. The major problem was pitch. Open F was just awful. Im the kind of guy that doesn't like to use alternate fingerings for what should be the tuning note of a horn. The sound on this really wasn't that great either, not very colorful. It did have a good low C. If the open F didn't suck so hard I could recommend this as a cheap starter horn but I just can't do that. Save up your money and get something better.

Other people here really like the Chinese horns but after playing now a total of 12 different Chinese made horns from different companies (including the newest from the flute company) I just can't recommend any of those horns. I mean gosh I have a scar now due to a 186 copy cutting my hand open. Slide ferrule was so sharp it sliced me open. Buy any of these at your own risk. Do not expect a great horn.

[cjk]

[ghmerrill]

I was very tempted by this Chinese F tuba as well. But I have talked with some people who have tried them (including one of the US importers who decided to stop offering the horn), and the universal response is that they are just not good. The intonation apparently is just terrible.

There is still a fairly high degree of variability in the Chinese instruments. Some are very good or excellent. Others are okay. Others are really bad. The compensating Eb tubas have a very good reputation, and the compensating euphoniums have perhaps an even better reputation. About a week ago I took delivery of one of the compensating euphoniums from Mack Brass (a sponsor here), and am astounded by how good the fit and finish are on the horn. With a Wick 3AL mouthpiece I have pretty much of a four octave range and the tone and intonation are excellent. And even the low B (1+2+3+4) sounds good.

But I wouldn't touch one of those F tubas.

[Curmudgeon]

Open F was just awful. Im the kind of guy that doesn't like to use alternate fingerings for what should be the tuning note of a horn.

You're just being unreasonable. It looks like an F tuba. Isn't that enough for you?

[talleyrand]

Diegoo,

Some love them, some hate them. I have no opinion, but if you search "Jinbao F" you'll come up with several long threads discussing them.

Reading through those will give you a sense of their strengths (yes, some people do think they are worthwhile) as well as their weaknesses. (And it will also be a good primer in the skill of reading TubeNet. The learning curve is a vertical wall.)

[ghmerrill]

Note that one of these seems to still be for sale used and with a gig bag in the "For Sale" forum: http://forums.chisham.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=47844 .

[MartyNeilan]

I have talked to most of the importers of these horns over the last year, and have found out a few interesting things:
The "original" version that is still for sale (and even listed as an "upgraded" model due to a different leadpipe) has a great low register, overall good sound and response, but a few intonation issues that can either be fixed by lipping, alternate fingerings, or a trigger. People either love or hate these horns, but with a little work they are very playable.
The true "upgraded" version costs somewhat more and does not share these intonation issues. There have been a few people able to play both side by side, and they have immediately noticed the difference.

If I was to buy one of these horns, I would talk to the importers directly and spend the extra bucks on the one with the good open F.

Here is a very good and honest thread about the original version of these horns:
http://forums.chisham.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=44720

Marty "not schilling for anyone."

[bloke]

We've all watched someone add a main slide trigger to one, and then sell it for c. $1500.

Of course, "Tuning is NOT in the instrument; Tuning is in the player."

bloke "um-hum"

[Neptune]

I have stopped selling these despite frequent requests for F tubas. I personally tried one for rehearsal with my brass quintet and found it just impossible to play in tune and therefore am not prepared to retail (I will not sell any tuba I am not satisfied playing myself).

No doubt the fit and finish was bad on Chinese brass in the past, but now is really impressively good as frequently gets remarked by people visiting my trade stand - I have even noticed a marked improvement in just the 8 months I have been selling. Not one tuba I have so far sold has been returned with any kind of mechanical defect. Nothing worst than an unsoldered stay has been experienced.

For good playing models, you cannot go wrong with the compensated EEb and rotary CC (both being used professionally), the Alex style rotary BBb, 1291 based piston BBb, compensated Euphonium, or Eb/F travel tuba to name a few...

Note: The factories are obliging to customise models for individual importers, so you cannot be sure if apparently the same model from different sources is the same, or for that matter even comes from the same factory. If someone has solved the intonation problems of that F, then congratulations to them!

[Diegoo]

Right, you do not recommend this tuba, Maybe I can to pay a bit more and speak With The company for them to settle and open the F of my tuba, maybe........
Thanks a lot Mr.

Played them, more than one of them. Valves kinda sucked. Slides were really rough. The major problem was pitch. Open F was just awful. Im the kind of guy that doesn't like to use alternate fingerings for what should be the tuning note of a horn. The sound on this really wasn't that great either, not very colorful. It did have a good low C. If the open F didn't suck so hard I could recommend this as a cheap starter horn but I just can't do that. Save up your money and get something better.

Other people here really like the Chinese horns but after playing now a total of 12 different Chinese made horns from different companies (including the newest from the flute company) I just can't recommend any of those horns. I mean gosh I have a scar now due to a 186 copy cutting my hand open. Slide ferrule was so sharp it sliced me open. Buy any of these at your own risk. Do not expect a great horn.

[Diegoo]

Thanks for your opinion Mr.I will think about this.

I was very tempted by this Chinese F tuba as well. But I have talked with some people who have tried them (including one of the US importers who decided to stop offering the horn), and the universal response is that they are just not good. The intonation apparently is just terrible.

There is still a fairly high degree of variability in the Chinese instruments. Some are very good or excellent. Others are okay. Others are really bad. The compensating Eb tubas have a very good reputation, and the compensating euphoniums have perhaps an even better reputation. About a week ago I took delivery of one of the compensating euphoniums from Mack Brass (a sponsor here), and am astounded by how good the fit and finish are on the horn. With a Wick 3AL mouthpiece I have pretty much of a four octave range and the tone and intonation are excellent. And even the low B (1+2+3+4) sounds good.

But I wouldn't touch one of those F tubas.