

https://www.ebay.com/itm/CLEAN-KING-234 ... 0290.m3507" target="_blank" target="_blank
Read Description in the Auction...the elephant wrote:It says $3250.
No, because the seller is a real seller and the actual asking price is a real "legit?" price. The first paragraph was what I wanted to bring attention to about his claims on how much these horns go for "elsewhere" wherever that might be.bigtubby wrote:Out of idle curiosity, does this fall under the "Please No eBay Scandal Posts"?
Asking for a friend.
12/26 Now $2850the elephant wrote:It says $3250.
They are a legitmate seller and the price is probably a good price, but the suggestion that $12,299 is a fair retail price makes the entire posting suspect.The Big Ben wrote:Regardless of the other price doodoo posted, if it is fully restored and lacquered as they say, $2850 might be a good price.
$2,850 is a good deal for this refurbished tuba + cases. The seller is good and legit; I bought a tuba from them years ago.....bort wrote:Is 2850 a good deal? I don't know. Someone will probably buy it.
No one is "dragging" anyone through the mud. We (some of us) are just interested in keeping honest sellers, honest. The only reason he was fluffing the numbers was likely to add more intrinsic value to the OLDER model 2341 by posting non-relevant and incorrect prices (even for the new model) so that the unsuspecting buyer may think he was getting a great deal at $3,250 then. Now with the horn being $2,850 with all that is mentioned is a decent deal, never had any question that his asking prices were out in left field, just his description (which was dishonest) to randomly use strange astronomical numbers in an auction for an older model horn that is a refurb.lost wrote:Thanks for posting that link bort. We shouldn't drag ebay sellers through the mud, especially ones we already know are reputable.
This was my point from the beginning. This is probably a decent horn either way, but the description.roweenie wrote:At first, I hadn't really given this MSRP "discrepancy" much thought (as MSRP is basically a fictional number that you'd have to be a fool to pay), but I've got to say that the phrase "somewhat exaggerated" is "somewhat understated". It's one thing to compare the model number to the current MSRP (which may or may not be correct) but it's another thing entirely to compare it to what is essentially a completely different instrument.
The actual selling price, reasonable or not, is irrelevant to this discussion - it's the comparison being drawn that IS relevant, as this comparison is being used as a selling point. Not everyone buying tubas is as informed as we are here on this forum; words actually mean something, and one should choose them wisely.
At best, it can be attributed to a lack of knowledge of the product (as suggested by Kiltie), but even then, the suspected lack of product knowledge does not instill much confidence, at least as far as I'm concerned.
(This reminds me of the York/Yorkmaster comparisons I have seen being made - other than the word "York" in the name, they are essentially different instruments, giving them corresponding different value).
Just to give this important matter its due consideration, how true is that? I can think of some cases where the same ID has been given to a different tuba - Conn 36K fiberglass sousaphone, that name now applies to historically a King model I believe. In this case though, they're comparing with arguably the current revision of the same 2341 design, which may have some improvements (?) but lacks the sought-after detachable bell feature. (ha ha.) The difference just happens to be more conspicuous, than if they'd changed valve plating, or the manner in which the big parts are formed, etc. Do they really play different?roweenie wrote:but it's another thing entirely to compare it to what is essentially a completely different instrument.
Maybe to you, but maybe not to someone who doesn't possess your/my/our knowledge.bloke wrote:sheesh...
I sure wish I had read this instead:
Actually, yes, they do play different from each other. Aside from the sought-after detachable bell feature (ha, ha, I own a few horns like this, just for that reason), the bells have an entirely different profile from each other - and the way King was able to add length to a drastically shortened instrument (the height difference is at least 6") was to add more cylindrical tubing on the MTS, so now the taper is significantly different, too. In fact, although I haven't looked at the parts lists recently, I don't think any of the bugle parts are interchangeable between the two horns - I certainly know that the bell, 5th branch, and dogleg are decidedly not. (Edit - the bottom bow, top bow, 3rd and 4th branches are in fact identical, but that is all....however, the bell alone is so radically different as to make it a completely different instrument, and I was correct that the 5th branch and dogleg are different, as is the mouthpipe).Donn wrote:Just to give this important matter its due consideration, how true is that? I can think of some cases where the same ID has been given to a different tuba - Conn 36K fiberglass sousaphone, that name now applies to historically a King model I believe. In this case though, they're comparing with arguably the current revision of the same 2341 design, which may have some improvements (?) but lacks the sought-after detachable bell feature. (ha ha.) The difference just happens to be more conspicuous, than if they'd changed valve plating, or the manner in which the big parts are formed, etc. Do they really play different?roweenie wrote:but it's another thing entirely to compare it to what is essentially a completely different instrument.
Now this, this is a deal. I probably know some collectors who might be interested in that instrument, Duck's son being one of them...bloke wrote:If not, send me $3K for my 1974 Fender Jazz Bass (which I bought from a friend in 1975).
Hey, my bass guitar is ACTUALLY valued at $10,000, so...