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Yet another...name that tuba!

Postby Tubajug » Tue Apr 16, 2019 2:16 pm

Greetings,

I was alerted to an estate sale with the horn pictured below for sale. I'm going to check it out tonight, but thought I'd get your thoughts on it. I was told it is a Martin, but I don't know anything beyond what I've seen/read here on TubeNet. If anyone can confirm or refute that, I'd appreciate it. It certainly looks to be in Eb (which is fine with me) but I've been lusting after a helicon for a while, and to have one pop up in my own city (we don't get too many local tuba sales here in Nebraska, let alone helicons...) was too good to pass up. Any thoughts, comments, etc. are most welcome!

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Jordan
King 2341 with a Holton "Monster" Eb bell
Eb Frankentuba in progress
Martin Medium Eb Helicon

Used to own, but still a fun thread: Lyon & Healy Eb

If at first you don't succeed, skydiving's probably not for you.
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Re: Yet another...name that tuba!

Postby YORK-aholic » Tue Apr 16, 2019 2:27 pm

The valveset looks like a Martin to me. Definitely an Eb Helicon. N

Might be an interesting horn. The smaller model of Martin Eb tubas were pretty good playing.
Some old Yorks, Martins and maybe a rotary King...
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Re: Yet another...name that tuba!

Postby Tubajug » Tue Apr 16, 2019 3:32 pm

Good deal! Of course, I'll see when I get there tonight, but it certainly looks like it's in pretty decent shape dent-wise. The bell is nice and straight at least!

Any idea on the bore size of these? If it's anything close the King Eb I'm updating, probably around 0.620"?

Do these need a bit to play or are they plug and play right into the receiver?
Jordan
King 2341 with a Holton "Monster" Eb bell
Eb Frankentuba in progress
Martin Medium Eb Helicon

Used to own, but still a fun thread: Lyon & Healy Eb

If at first you don't succeed, skydiving's probably not for you.
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Re: Yet another...name that tuba!

Postby YORK-aholic » Tue Apr 16, 2019 5:58 pm

The "Medium" or Renowned Eb tubas had a bore of about .620 also. I'd imagine that this raincatcher would be based on the same valve cluster/bore size rather than having infinite sizes of tubing to store.
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Re: Yet another...name that tuba!

Postby Tubajug » Tue Apr 16, 2019 8:38 pm

Well, I went and picked it up. The price was right, and it's a bit more rough than I had thought, but I've always wanted a helicon and it looks like nothing I can't handle on my own. The neck might not be original (it has electrical tape at the end to fit it into the receiver), there's no bit(s?), some dents in the big bow, and something is making it really stuffy when I blew into just by sticking a mouthpiece into the neck to try it out. It is silver with a gold wash bell interior. It will be a project to get it up and running, but when a helicon showed up locally, I had to grab it (and my wife was gracious enough to call and arrange the meeting while I was at work!).
Jordan
King 2341 with a Holton "Monster" Eb bell
Eb Frankentuba in progress
Martin Medium Eb Helicon

Used to own, but still a fun thread: Lyon & Healy Eb

If at first you don't succeed, skydiving's probably not for you.
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Re: Yet another...name that tuba!

Postby roweenie » Tue Apr 16, 2019 8:59 pm

Awesome find - congratulations!

Tubajug wrote:something is making it really stuffy when I blew into just by sticking a mouthpiece into the neck to try it out


I once had an old helicon that was blocked up by a severely desiccated rat - - - maybe they like helicons for some strange reason?

Oh, and by the way, WHAT IS IT?????

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Re: Yet another...name that tuba!

Postby Heavy_Metal » Tue Apr 16, 2019 10:17 pm

Could be anything- here's one I had:

viewtopic.php?f=11&t=69969&p=572382
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Old (early 1900s?) Alexander BBb proto-163
1976 Sonora (B&S 101) 4-rotor BBb
1964 Conn 20J/21J BBb (one body, both bells)
1970s Marzan Slant-rotor BBb
~1904 York 3-piston BBb Helicon
Old Alexander Compensating F, getting valve job
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Re: Yet another...name that tuba!

Postby Tubajug » Tue Apr 16, 2019 10:43 pm

I'll post more pictures, probably tomorrow, but all I know now is it's a small- bore, Eb Martin made in Elkhart, Indiana. All the slides and valves came out, so I gave it a quick rinse outside with the garden hose. Nothing major came out of it, so perhaps one of the valves was out of alignment? I won't know until I can clean off all the gunk and find a useable neck and bits. The neck looks like it's got several layers of solder and glue holding it together.
Jordan
King 2341 with a Holton "Monster" Eb bell
Eb Frankentuba in progress
Martin Medium Eb Helicon

Used to own, but still a fun thread: Lyon & Healy Eb

If at first you don't succeed, skydiving's probably not for you.
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Re: Yet another...name that tuba!

Postby YORK-aholic » Tue Apr 16, 2019 11:13 pm

Since find Sir!
Some old Yorks, Martins and maybe a rotary King...
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Re: Yet another...name that tuba!

Postby Tubajug » Wed Apr 17, 2019 12:22 pm

Here are some photos I took prior to rinsing it out with a garden hose:

Image

Here is one from horn-u-copia's page. They look similar, though the brace between the bell and the shoulder rest is shorter on mine and the wrap after the valveset is different.

Image

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Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

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According to horn-u-copia's serial number chart, this one was made in 1927-28. Cool!
Jordan
King 2341 with a Holton "Monster" Eb bell
Eb Frankentuba in progress
Martin Medium Eb Helicon

Used to own, but still a fun thread: Lyon & Healy Eb

If at first you don't succeed, skydiving's probably not for you.
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Re: Yet another...name that tuba!

Postby iiipopes » Wed Apr 17, 2019 4:29 pm

Hang on to that neck!!!
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Fanned fret bass and electric guitars
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Re: Yet another...name that tuba!

Postby Tubajug » Wed Apr 17, 2019 7:30 pm

iiipopes wrote:Hang on to that neck!!!


Even if it doesn't fit and is covered in what looks to be epoxy?
Jordan
King 2341 with a Holton "Monster" Eb bell
Eb Frankentuba in progress
Martin Medium Eb Helicon

Used to own, but still a fun thread: Lyon & Healy Eb

If at first you don't succeed, skydiving's probably not for you.
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Re: Yet another...name that tuba!

Postby YORK-aholic » Thu Apr 18, 2019 9:47 am

Tubajug wrote:Even if it doesn't fit


Define 'doesn't fit' :-)

Obviously that receiver where it goes in needs a band with the tension screw replaced and what is left there has been sort of wallowed out. Once that is squared away will the gooseneck still be too small? :shock:
Some old Yorks, Martins and maybe a rotary King...
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Re: Yet another...name that tuba!

Postby Tubajug » Thu Apr 18, 2019 10:54 am

YORK-aholic wrote:
Tubajug wrote:Even if it doesn't fit


Define 'doesn't fit' :-)

Obviously that receiver where it goes in needs a band with the tension screw replaced and what is left there has been sort of wallowed out. Once that is squared away will the gooseneck still be too small? :shock:


It does have the tension band/screw, I just took it off to show the condition of the receiver. I guess if the whole receiver, neck, and bits can be procured, that would be nice.
Jordan
King 2341 with a Holton "Monster" Eb bell
Eb Frankentuba in progress
Martin Medium Eb Helicon

Used to own, but still a fun thread: Lyon & Healy Eb

If at first you don't succeed, skydiving's probably not for you.
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Re: Yet another...name that tuba!

Postby YORK-aholic » Thu Apr 18, 2019 12:55 pm

Tubajug wrote: I guess if the whole receiver, neck, and bits can be procured, that would be nice.


Looks like you might get to try your hand at fabrication from scratch. 8)
(Hopefully, something will show up)
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Re: Yet another...name that tuba!

Postby KiltieTuba » Thu Apr 18, 2019 1:02 pm

That Martin helicon from horn-u-copia is mine. Mine's built in D, you can see the longer tuning slides compared to your Eb.
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Re: Yet another...name that tuba!

Postby Tubajug » Thu Apr 18, 2019 4:21 pm

KiltieTuba wrote:That Martin helicon from horn-u-copia is mine. Mine's built in D, you can see the longer tuning slides compared to your Eb.


Cool, I came across the video of you playing that horn as I was looking around for information.
Jordan
King 2341 with a Holton "Monster" Eb bell
Eb Frankentuba in progress
Martin Medium Eb Helicon

Used to own, but still a fun thread: Lyon & Healy Eb

If at first you don't succeed, skydiving's probably not for you.
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Re: Yet another...name that tuba!

Postby YORK-aholic » Thu Apr 18, 2019 6:31 pm

KiltieTuba wrote:Mine's built in D, you can see the longer tuning slides compared to your Eb.


Maybe that's where Mr. Bob got the idea to have Miraphone build him a D tuba! :shock: :lol:
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Re: Yet another...name that tuba!

Postby Tubajug » Tue Apr 23, 2019 2:23 pm

So, just a minor update here. I found the following page from a 1916 Martin catalog. While the instrument shown is a BBb helicon, it made me think that perhaps these only used one bit? If I can find/use/repurpose one, I might have an easier time getting this playing than I originally thought. We shall see. It also would seem that mine certainly falls into the Martin "Medium" category, as I can't imagine there being one much smaller than this. It really doesn't seem like a "Monster" Eb Helicon as is listed in the catalog.

Image
Jordan
King 2341 with a Holton "Monster" Eb bell
Eb Frankentuba in progress
Martin Medium Eb Helicon

Used to own, but still a fun thread: Lyon & Healy Eb

If at first you don't succeed, skydiving's probably not for you.
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